1246: Mike Feldstein | How Bad Air Hijacks Your Brain and Body

1246: Mike Feldstein | How Bad Air Hijacks Your Brain and Body

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Jordan Harbinger: [00:00:00] Welcome to the show. I'm jordan Harbinger. On The Jordan Harbinger Show, we decode the stories, secrets, and skills of the world's most fascinating people and turn their wisdom into practical advice that you can use to impact your own life and those around you. Our mission is to help you become a better informed, more critical thinker through long form conversations with a variety of amazing folks, from spies to CEOs, athletes, authors, thinkers, performers, even the occasional former jihadi, astronaut, hacker, or real life pirate.

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Just visit Jordan harbinger.com/start or search for us in your Spotify app to get started. Today on the show we're back with Mike Feldstein, founder of Jaspr Mold Slayer extraordinaire, and a guy who looks at indoor air the way a sommelier [00:01:00] looks at a questionable gas station Chardonnay. Mike just got back from the aftermath of the L.A. fires and the news is not great.

We'll talk about what the smoke actually leaves behind, how long the air stays toxic even after the flames go out, and what people are really breathing when the sky looks normal again. But the particulate count is still doing numbers like a crypto scam. We'll also get into the mold industry's dark side, the fear-mongering, the unnecessary home destruction, and why an entire ecosystem of naturopaths and mold inspectors has turned into a feedback loop of panic about air quality.

And if you've ever wondered how your house could be giving you sick home syndrome. Or what might Zs for humans, you're in the right place. Then of course, my favorite part, the Air Brain Connection. How oxygen and CO2 levels in your home can impact your focus, your energy, mood recovery, and while your kids' behavior at school might have more to do with classroom CO2 than screen time.

We're obsessed with breath work while completely ignoring the air that we actually breathe the rest of the time, which is kinda like trying to optimize your diet while living on vending machine burritos all this and a [00:02:00] whole lot more today on The Jordan Harbinger Show. Here we go with Mike Feldstein.

Welcome back to the show. Look, it took a little, little doing here. We got our wires all set up. We got our Jaspr in the shot. That's actually always there. I want people, I feel obliged to tell people that I did not put that there as

Mike Feldstein: I was actually saying move it.

Jordan Harbinger: Yeah. Yeah. You wanted it out of the shot.

But that's where that goes actually. So we, it's authentic to leave it there, even though it looks like product placement. Oh, thanks for having me here. Yeah, man, I appreciate you coming back. 'cause I know before we talked about air quality, we talked about fire remediation stuff and I kind of want to go over a little bit of that.

People can always go back to the original episode. Producer Jase, why don't you drop the episode number in here 'cause I don't have it in front of me. Tell everyone where to go find that.

Jase Sanderson: Sure thing, Jordan. Hi everybody. The previous conversation with Mike is episode 1071. You can find that in the feed wherever you get your podcasts or search for it at jordanharbinger.com.

Jordan Harbinger: But since you were here, there were actually major wildfires in California. [00:03:00] And you went back to L.A. to check out the aftermath of the fires. And I'd love to talk about how bad the air is. 'cause before we kind of talk just generally about fires and what they can do to the air, but I, I wonder how bad the air is after, say Palisades for example, and how long the air stays toxic after a fire.

Mike Feldstein: The first episode was air quality 101. Yeah. So if you didn't hear the last one and you're like, what does air quality have to do with anything? Right. And you have no awareness of air and maybe you pay attention to the food you eat and the water you drink, but you have not yet thought about air has a really important thing then.

Yeah. Listen to the first episode. So the L.A. wildfire was a really interesting one. The big answer is no one knows for sure 'cause this was unprecedented. How long it's gonna be contaminated. What is the actual, but it's still

Jordan Harbinger: contaminated, I assume. Yeah.

Mike Feldstein: Well you have to go test again. I see. You have to test not just air.

How about the soil? How about the water? People's carpets, the materials in their home. But the reason I also went is I'm very qualified in this type of fire. Most fire restoration companies, they have [00:04:00] experience with a kitchen fire, a house fire, not like giant regional fires where a whole city is infected because you know, you see on the news, they talk about people who lost their home, but way more people have smoke damage than people who lost their home.

Also, we've never had a fire before where 15,000 cars burnt down. When a regular forest fire happens, you just have like tree smoke and it's still a problem. Yeah. But it's regular smoke when homes and cars and stores, every can of paint, every WD 40, all the, the insulation, the drywall materials. Just think about when you put, like, everyone's been at a campfire and they run out of s'mores and someone puts that bag of, and you smell that toxic plastic bag on the fire.

Mm. You're like, that smells like cancer. Yeah. Well, imagine that times 15,000 homes. Right? 10, 20,000 cars. And thousands and thousands of those cars were Teslas and other electric vehicles. Right. So what happens when you burn 10,000 lithium batteries? Yeah. We don't

Jordan Harbinger: know.

Mike Feldstein: Well,

Jordan Harbinger: it's more than that, right?

'cause each Tesla has hundreds of lithium batteries that are about the size of, well, bigger than a, [00:05:00] bigger than any battery you'd have in your house about the size of a small

Mike Feldstein: flashlight. So that's the thing that's really concerning the wildfire smoke. You know, we, we'd normally look at things like something called PAH polycyclic, aromatic hydrocarbons.

A bunch of big fancy words for a lot of chemicals that are really bad for you. Okay. But in this case, we had homes and we had cars that burnt down. The one thing that L.A. has going for it is, it's coastal nature is the best air purifier. And being right on the coast, a lot of the winds brought everything out.

Whereas like if it, it's in Alberta, Canada, or Utah or Colorado, socked into these valleys, things aren't flowing as much. But yeah, when I went six weeks after the fire, so mid-February of this year, 2025, and I tested a bunch of homes and it was wild. The air quality, I was measuring it throughout the day.

It was fluctuating dramatically throughout the day because all it takes is a little bit of wind. And then everyone thought, like once they had their first rain, everyone's like, we're fine now. Mm-hmm. I'm like, not [00:06:00] exactly guys. First of all, now that's all into your water. Yeah. It's all in your soil. And then it dries up.

It's not like those toxic materials aren't still a problem. I put a picture on my Instagram of molten aluminum rivers running down streets. Whoa. Because literally like the aluminum blocks in cars. It got so hot that metal would melt and liquefy and form rivers, down streets. That's crazy. So if we know heavy metals are a problem, generally imagine at that degree, so like nine 11 turns out it was really bad and a lot of people got sick who were in that area.

So yeah, I was getting asked the question a lot from people in L.A. Should we move? And I'm like, if you were on the fence about it already, like this would be a, a thing that would tip it. Sure. But everybody there, if you weren't filtering your air and even if you had a lot of air filtering, but you didn't have like, you lost power, their carpets, their furniture, their clothing, everything was really contaminated.

And if you didn't do something about detoxing it, it still is. There was a lady, we went to her [00:07:00] home 'cause we messaged our local, our Jaspr customers and we're like, Hey, we're in town. We'll come to your home. Test your air. And this one lady, she asked me to check her friend who lived one floor above in an apartment.

Cool thing. She had like an 800 square foot apartment. One Jaspr, one floor above exact same unit. No Jasprs, the air quality in his carpet was like uninhabitable. Like you have to leave completely toxic. And her place was almost perfectly normal,

Jordan Harbinger: really. So this is a good, uh, what do you call it? Like almost single variable.

The only difference is it's a floor higher, but otherwise the layout's the same.

Mike Feldstein: Santa Monica two miles from the fire. Wow. And we built Jaspr for wildfire smoke for anyone who didn't listen last time. My background was in wildfire remediation, floods, hurricane cleanup. So my career was traveling around to Hurricane Harvey and California wildfires, like wherever the most toxic disasters were.

Mm-hmm. That's where I would go. And um, the reason that I got into Jaspr making these air scrubbers is because the machines that we would use on the job site were these big, [00:08:00] large industrial machines. And when you would compare that to little air purifiers in the store. I was able to see like these little things don't work.

So the vision Yeah, was let's create a product that has the effectiveness. Basically, let's make the world's first air scrubber design for your home. So now I'm kind of on a mission to just talk about air quality. Anyone who's thinking about water and hasn't thought about air, my kind of mission for the next 20 years is to increase people's awareness of the air that you breathe.

One thing that,

Jordan Harbinger: we were talking about this at lunch, how we ended up meeting. So we were friends for years before and then I thought, hey, I might have mold in my house. I can't remember why. Oh right. Because I had them come and figure out something out with the hvac, 'cause my studio had crappy circulation.

So he called the HVAC guy and he goes, yeah, I added, I don't know, a return or something. So yada yada. It works better. But he is like, by the way, you have mold in something. The tube wasn't fit correctly. Something something with the hvac. Okay. And he's like, there's mold in there. I was like, oh [00:09:00] uh, what should I do about that?

He is like, well, I fit the tube in, but there's still mold in there. You might want to do something about that. So I emailed a mold expert and they were like, yeah, well you know what you can do is I can test it, but you're still gonna have mold. So here's this $30,000 mold remediation system that filters all the mold out of your HVAC forever.

And I was like, damn, that's a lot. I don't want to sanity check that. So I emailed someone else and they were like, no, talk to this guy Mike Feldstein because he knows a lot. And I was like, I know that guy. So I emailed you 'cause you had just spammed me with something for Jaspr like the week prior. And I was like, not only are we friends, I got the, the, the air filter thing.

And you were like, Hey dude. This is what stayed with me since our last episode. You were like, no matter how clean your HVAC is, it kind of doesn't matter because if it's on your couch or your carpet or somewhere else in the house, you can blow in clean air from outside. But if you have dirty air in your house, you have dirty air in your house, something has to clean the air in the house.

There's no point in getting a 30,000 maybe for me anyway. No point in getting a $30,000 mold thing for your HVAC when you [00:10:00] might have mold in your carpet or your couch or some other thing. Just get, it's kinda like at the end point. Yes. Get

Mike Feldstein: something that cleans it. It's kinda like water. Yeah. You could have the cleanest pipes ever.

Yeah. And still have a horrible city. Water with water. You know, you could put a filter on your shower. Mm-hmm. You could put it on your sink, you could put it on the fridge. You could put a whole home water filter system in. But basically it doesn't matter what's happening upstream. Right. You need that clean water has close to the point of consumption and air is the exact same.

Yes. My point with the mold

Jordan Harbinger: was. That the industry for mold is like fear-based and possibly scammy. Well, I was so relieved when I didn't need to buy a $20,000 system to get rid of this mold that was in my HVAC unit and I bought Jaspr's instead. And they're doing a better job. 'cause even the thing that that guy said it couldn't do, which is clean the air that's already in the house.

And I love the,

Mike Feldstein: the, it just worked out with that timing. Yeah. So I remember, I like, you know, we were new at the time. We were in business for like a couple years and I was like, Hey, none of my old like high school friends or anybody knows what I did. Yeah. So I pulled [00:11:00] together all the emails of like everyone's email I ever had, right.

From Gmail and from Facebook. And I was like, Hey, this is what I'm doing. You're like, you know, you got my email and within a couple weeks you had like a crazy story with like a fire in the neighborhood. Oh, that's right. And that's when you, you were like more, you were like, yo, this is no joke.

Jordan Harbinger: Yeah. I gave you a, a testimonial by accident I think because I thought, oh, this is pretty cool how it has an air quality meter on it.

'cause I'd bought a separate air quality meter because we were getting fires and I wanted an air quality meter outside. To see what the air was like outside of my neighborhood. And I checked it in this app, this purple app or whatever. Yeah, purple air. And it would be clean, clean, clean. And then there'd be a fire, it'd be orange, it'd be like 68, so not super clean or whatever it was.

And then I noticed that the Jaspr has it right on the display and none of our other air purifiers actually had that. So I thought that was kind of interesting. And then one day the Jaspr went crazy while I was sitting here doing work and I was like, ah, I better tell Mike that this thing is just defective and randomly going crazy.

And [00:12:00] it kept going and going. And I was going, getting up to go unplug it when I heard fire engine sounds. And then I went out the front door because I heard the fire engine sounds really loud and a block and a half away. There was a house fire that I couldn't smell at all. But the Jaspr had picked up early and had been furiously scrubbing the air.

And of course, well as soon as I went outside I was like, boom. 'cause it just smelled like burning roof tar. And the fire engine had come and I drove. I got in my car and drove around. I mean, it was a massive, massive house fire. And I thought that was really interesting 'cause the Jaspr had been going for like 10 minutes.

So basically that fire started and seconds, maybe minutes later, at most the Jaspr started cleaning the air. I smelled nothing until I went outside and then I smelled it. Uh, and so this, this thing is, it's got a pretty sensitive sniffer on it. It's like

Mike Feldstein: with, you know, why, why do we have carbon monoxide detectors and carbon dioxide detectors?

Like we're good, decent at smelling things, but we're not that good, right? So there's a lot of these situations where we like to say Jaspr's nose, nose before your nose knows. Mm-hmm. So this [00:13:00] type of stuff happens all the time. And really the way homes are built now, that's like what I was telling you last time is homes just aren't designed well for humans to live inside of them.

At its core, there's a builder, maybe an architect and a developer. It's like, how fast can we build this home? How cheap? Make a nice master bathroom in a pretty kitchen. Mm-hmm. And people buy it. You get a home inspection, seven, $800. It literally says, so I became a home inspector, by the way. It was like a four day online course.

Speaker 4: Okay.

Mike Feldstein: Isn't that crazy? Yeah. And so to become a certified mold man, it's a two day course with a very long lunch break. And to become a home inspector was a four day online course

Jordan Harbinger: that explains why they come over high and when they do their job. We had a, we had a couple stoned home inspectors. We had to rotate, make sure they were actually doing their job.

That's funny

Mike Feldstein: and sad. So people are making the biggest investment of their entire life. And Googling a trusted home inspector. Mm-hmm. Who comes over and on that contract that they give you, it basically says. This is not looking for anything [00:14:00] environmental. Mm-hmm. So mold, asbestos, lead bacteria, basically, you know, they're looking for like a plug that doesn't work.

Or a crack in your foundation. Yeah. Crack. Yeah. Silly things like that. They're like, Hey, uh, your GFCI outlet is like, you're like, that's a 200 electrical fix. Right. But it's like you might have a mold infestation and they won't mention it at all. They don't know anything about mold. They're not trained on mold the same way doctors aren't really trained on nutrition.

Mm-hmm. The HVAC industry and home builders and home inspectors aren't trained about mold, which is like the purpose of the home is to safely house a family. Right. And then there's this stuff that a lot of homes have in it that's killing people. And you're making your biggest investment of your life where your family's also going to live in.

Mm-hmm. And no one's actually checking for it. So I think there's a, yeah. That's scary. There's a huge opportunity now and some home inspectors are getting into it, but like also, if you're ever gonna buy a home and you go into it and you smell air fresheners, unplug them first of all, and you must demand another inspection.

It's the oldest trick in the book when people are selling moldy homes, they put air fresheners everywhere. So you come in and how do air [00:15:00] fresheners work? They hijack your ability to smell. So fragrances, scents, think of Christmas tree in the Uber, Glade plugins, all that kind of stuff. Mm-hmm. Those products are not designed to, they don't clean, they don't disinfect.

All they do is they hijack your noses ability to actually smell things. Do you know how FE works? Yeah.

Jordan Harbinger: So I didn't know this. I thought Febreze, this episode is clearly not sponsored by, maybe you'll hear why in a second. I thought Febreze killed the bacteria or whatever that was making the smell, because I was like, how does this work?

Turns out what it does is it basically limits your nose's ability to smell things. So it's like, wait, wait, wait. So this thing still reeks. It's just that all of our noses inhale this thing first. It's like Novocaine for your sense of smell. So basically you, you sniff that and then you can't smell the fact that it smells like absolute crap and has bo all over it or whatever else.

S this's a

Mike Feldstein: big, big so gross deal. Yeah. It's kind of like natural flavors and food. They feed you a bunch of garbage, they pour some chemicals in, they don't make it taste good. Mm-hmm. They [00:16:00] just stop your ability to smell the na taste, the nasty stuff that's so gross. And then they hammer you with some chemicals that give you some addictive sensations.

But the fragrances, like, I'm on a war against synthetic fragrances. Mm. I, I am screaming from my, the rooftops that synthetic fragrances are the new secondhand smoke.

Jordan Harbinger: I want to hear more about the, well, let me back up a little bit. Sure. 'cause I actually, before I, this thought flies away from me. Yes. I gifted a Jaspr to a couple of friends because they had a mold problem.

And what they did is they, they went to the doctor and the doctor was like, oh, maybe you have mold exposure. They did a bunch of testing in their house. Then they were like, dude, I gotta gut my entire wall of to pay 80 grand or whatever. It was like some crazy amount of money to remediate this mold. And I told 'em to get us.

I mean, look, you don't want mold in your house, but you are gonna tear down your whole house. It just seemed a little bit unnecessary. I remember talking to you casually about this. Can you,

Mike Feldstein: you know what I'm talking about. You remember this? I'm very glad you brought that up. In the mold industry, they have two sayings.

One is the mold rush and the other one is mold is gold. [00:17:00] I remember this. Yeah. So it's a big, big problem, man, because people now are going to the functional medicine doctor or the, you know, the naturopath or whatever it is, and they're sick. And they've been sick and they don't know why. They don't know what's making them feel weird.

They got brain fog, they have fatigue, they have gut issues. They go functional medicine doc gives them a bunch of urine and blood testing and they say, you got the mold. And then they say, test your house too. You got the mold basically. Everybody has mold and everybody's house has mold. So all it's like heavy metals, like, it's like microplastics.

It's not a black and white thing. How much mold, what species of mold. But the functional medicine doctors are literally trained in one or two days also. They're like, ah, I'm getting thousands of calls about mold toxicity. Let me take a quick two hour webinar. Yeah, webinar mold and become, become a, a certified mold expert myself.

And who teaches the testing? It's usually the companies that do the urine and blood testing. I see, okay. So they're the ones who sell the diagnostics to the functional medicine docs. So they go, you [00:18:00] got the mold, they check your out, you go out the mold. If we go outside and run a test, there's mold everywhere.

Mold is just in the air. See that?

Jordan Harbinger: That was my question. Is it all these people that are really sick with certain types of mold? I'm not doubting that these people are getting sick from mold. But they can't be getting sick from the amount of mold you would get playing in your backyard unless they have a serious allergy, like a medical issue with it.

But specifically for that, but like if you go outside and you don't get sick every single time you do, you obviously can tolerate some level of pain can.

Mike Feldstein: So it's like pollen and, yeah, it's kind of like another allergen it indoors. It's a bigger problem because you've trapped the mold inside. Right. So the best air filter in the world is nature, sun, wind, trees, rain homes.

Since the seventies, since the energy crisis, they've built homes so tight with the primary goal being energy efficiency that they've turned your home into like a Tupperware box, a little Tupperware container. So, so I should leave this big back slider open, is that what you're saying? Yeah, like fresh air is good.

Let's, let's the birds in the air screen. I mean, California, you have pretty beautiful weather, so like this is the place to do [00:19:00] it. Yeah. But if not, and most HVAC systems aren't designed to have fresh air and intakes. So the problem is like you don't get typically mold on the bread until you put it in the Tupperware and you choke it in there.

Interesting. So the reason that that people are having these issues inside their home is you have no sun, you have no wind. You have no rain, there's no filtration. It's trapped inside your home, can't breathe. The HVAC is the lungs of your home, and if your home can't breathe, the people inside it can't breathe.

A lot of people get triggered by mold, but it's become a very fear induced industry because basically I did mold remediation for years. Yeah. If you ask a company to come and renovate your bathroom, the demolition process to gut it is gonna be like a thousand bucks. If there's a little bit of mold, it's like 10,000 now.

Speaker 4: Mm.

Mike Feldstein: The only difference is you put up a piece of poly, basically about an hour of prep, a hundred dollars of material. And antimicrobial spray. So the cost for the mold remediation company is negligible. There's almost no [00:20:00] difference. Mm-hmm. So if you are a contractor doing demolition, charging a thousand dollars, you're like, wait a second.

And also, most bathrooms had mold anyway. They're like, we were already ripping up bathrooms with mold. You mean make a bit more of a show out of it and 10 x the price. This was a very attractive opportunity for a lot of contractors.

Jordan Harbinger: I guarantee you my bathroom has Ted, where there's a, so our bathtub has one of those shower heads that you can like pull out.

Yep. And then you can spray. Yep. It's in the bathtub. I pulled it up one time be I never use it. I pulled it up one time and sawdust fell off of it and I was like, what? So I shined a flashlight down there. Honestly, this thing that drips water constantly because it's a shower head, it goes into this little holster, and inside there is just the guts of the house.

Like it's just wooden beams, the crawl space. It's just a hole in, in that this shower rests in. And I'm like, wait a minute. There's not like a plastic thing in there. There's not some sort of receptacle? Nope. It just goes into the bottom of the house, next cavity. So there's a cavity there that just probably has like, mold in, in it.

I don't see how it could not have [00:21:00] mold in it at this point. And, and Earwigs, shitload of earwigs. What'd you do about

Mike Feldstein: the earwigs? Nothing.

Jordan Harbinger: I kill, I kill 'em every day. I kill these earwigs. Yeah. But like

Mike Feldstein: the, the main thing here is there is a dark side of the mold industry. Not everybody's a bad actor.

Mm-hmm. But you have to be quite careful when you're navigating it because you know, you feel the sense of relief when you get a blood test and you're like, Hey, wait, this is the cause of my sickness. Right. So you're, you're upset about the cost and you're annoyed, but you're like, finally, look, I have an explanation for my, yeah.

Have you noticed no one talks about Lyme disease anymore?

Speaker 4: Yeah. Mold

Mike Feldstein: is the new Lyme mold is the new Lyme disease. Yeah, you're right. That was trendy for a while. It's mold now trending. So it's crazy mo like if you look at the Google search volume of Lyme disease versus mold toxicity, it's like swapped.

That's interesting. You're right. People are always kinda looking for a a, it's that thing of like, I don't feel good and I just need like abla. It's like fibromyalgia. You kind of Yeah. A lot of people, there's these things that come that's like, this is this thing that can't exactly be diagnosed that explains why I'm sick.

But the, the sad thing is mold actually makes some people very sick. For sure. [00:22:00] Yeah. Um, people just have a really hard time deciphering what's true and what's not true. But basically what I want to get across is, unfortunately you have to do a little bit of your own homework and a little bit of your own digging.

Mm-hmm. But it's not black and white just 'cause you have some, a little bit of mold spores in your air and in your blood, like everybody does. If you test 10 people who feel great, everybody has mold in their blood, in their urine. So don't think it's like a, a black and white thing.

Jordan Harbinger: I see. So if I went to the doctor.

I said I don't feel good, and they tested for mold in my blood and urine. It would show up.

Speaker 4: Yeah.

Jordan Harbinger: But if I went in there and said. I feel great. Can you test my blood and urine for mold? They would find it in there anyway. It's always there. So it's like, ah, okay. So this is one of those things where when you feel bad, you find that and you go, this has to be it.

But then somebody else who feels totally fine goes in there and they have the exact same or higher level of mold and it's just not doing anything.

Mike Feldstein: Yes.

Jordan Harbinger: Interesting.

Mike Feldstein: And it's like heavy metals. Of course. We live, unless you live in like the Amazon rainforest, you have microplastics, you have heavy metals.

Jordan Harbinger: So this'll interest you I suppose. Uh, I went to Taiwan, we [00:23:00] did this like CEO health check where it's like ridiculously cheap, relatively speaking for like an MRI and a, a CT scan. And they get through every organ on your body and every system, and they scan your brain for like possible places where you're gonna have an aneurysm.

Like they just really go all in and they find stuff that's like stage zero cancer, where they go, if this is still here next year, you take this medicine and it'll go away, basically. And then like if, if it grows, you know, you might have something, but if not, and like every, I was like, oh my God, I have nodules and my thyroid.

And she was like, let me calm you down. Everyone has these, everybody. The nodules in your lungs. Yeah. You have lived on earth for 45 years. You have two nodules in your lungs. They're tiny. It is nothing. It's like a grain of sand. She's like, the problem is if it's the size of 10 grains of sand in two years, when you come back, then it's a problem because then it's, it's growing.

But she's like, everybody has something like this every, and I was like, oh my God, my spine's degenerating. She's like, yeah, and it's gonna get worse. And I was like, oh my God. She's like, it's called aging. It's called using your phone. It's called standing up. It's called sitting in a chair. So all these things, but one thing they did test for was [00:24:00] heavy metal.

And I was like, oh my gosh, I have super high off the charts, heavy metals, mercury, namely. And then I came back and I went to Kaiser and I was like, I need another check because this test could be spurious. I need to find out if I have all these heavy metals. I took another test and then Kaiser was like, we are gonna do another test just to make sure.

I was like, okay. So I've had three tests, all high and heavy metal. They're like, you need a call with toxicology. I call the toxicologist and he goes. Yeah. Do you ever eat sushi? I go, yeah. He goes, how much? I'm like, I don't know, once or twice a week. And he's like, okay, any other fish? I was like, I don't know salmon.

He's like, yeah, I wouldn't worry about this. And I was like, but my mercury levels. And he's like, yeah, why'd you test for Mercury? I said, oh, it was part of this big blood work package. He goes, yeah, I think if you picked. 99 out of a hundred people in your neighborhood or any neighborhood anywhere in California, you'd all have high mercury levels.

He's, he goes, you know what? I tested myself, I have high mercury. It doesn't matter. Everybody who eats fish or lives in a modern economy, like you said, doesn't live in the Amazon rainforest, has high mercury levels. He's like, and I said, well, why is the test showing red? He goes, [00:25:00] this is a problem if you don't eat fish because then you have mercury in your house, but if you're eating fish, this is a perfectly normal level of mercury to have in your blood.

And I was so, I appreciate that nuance

Mike Feldstein: ITing, because they could have sold you on a very extensive mercury detox protocol. Well,

Jordan Harbinger: there was a guy who was like, you should do chelation, right? And the toxicologist was like, that is the chelation process, which is removing heavy metals from the body. He is like, is so much more harmful for you than just dealing with this baseline level of mercury.

Chelation is like, it's oversimplified chemotherapy for getting rid of heavy metals. Like you're taking all these other metals and other minerals out of your body. Yeah. You

Mike Feldstein: go, you're like, they're like, you have too much of this thing. Here's 26 supplements to take. Yeah. And 17 drops. And you're like taking, and you're like, they're like, you might feel worse for a while.

I'm like, this is, doesn't feel right. No.

Jordan Harbinger: Yeah, exactly. This is like cutting off your dose to bite your face. It's really, it's he, so he basically was like, no need to go nuclear on it. The reason this relates to what you were saying is the fact that you're testing for mercury. Oh my God, you have high mercury.

Okay. Do you have any symptoms? No. Okay. Then go home. [00:26:00] That was his moral story. So the, the mold is very similar from the sound of it,

Mike Feldstein: so Yeah, exactly. It's like check your body for bacteria. Yeah. It's like you're like half bacteria. You're infested.

Jordan Harbinger: Yeah. Oh yeah.

Mike Feldstein: There's all these little creatures living inside you.

Right. So at the end of the day though, it's not to say mold can never be an issue, but unfortunately because of the fragrances and things like that, we've lost our ability to smell. I'd tested probably a thousand homes for mold and anyone I know who tested and do remediation. Within five seconds of walking in someone's home if they have mold or not.

Just 'cause you can smell. 'cause you smell it. I see. And you feel it. You. It's a little more difficult to breathe. It smells musty. It smells damp. If you walk into a baby's nursery, it smells like poo. You don't need a poo tester or a bacter airborne bacteria analysis. Right. Unfortunately, we've gone to this like quantifiable metrics data testing thing, and we've all lost the ability to just trust how we feel and trust our sense of smell.

And that's what this comes down to. So if it smells musty and there's a black patch growing on the wall, or there's water damage, [00:27:00] check your attic, check under bathrooms and sinks. Mm-hmm. And look for like bubbling drywall and like the visual inspection and the smell is by far the best inspection wall.

That's why the best mold inspector is the mold dog. Um, I've never heard of this. Yeah. There used to be, there's a few people who have like mold canines. That's the best by far because they're gonna smell and they, they're gonna go find the source of it amazing. But just to test your air and then they start investigate basically just.

Ripping out walls and stuff. Yes. That is similar to like being like, your levels of whatever are high. Let's just do some investigative surgery. Take some injectable, whatevers. Yeah. Well, let's just cut some holes in you. Oof. And check inside. You're like, uh, I don't think this is a good idea. Yeah. So people often go into debt of hundreds of thousands of dollars, rip their homes apart, move into apartments or homes that were moldier than their first home and debt and stress, and then they get much more sick.

So I've been seeing this increasing at a large scale, and that's why it has a mold remediation guy. How would we do mold removal? [00:28:00] We'd remove the physical mold and we would scrub the air. It was very simple like, so the Jaspr was very similar. It's basically the same machine that we would use to scrub the air from the mold.

So like, I'm not, I don't think you need to test your tap water. Just get a water filter

Jordan Harbinger: while you let that horrifying thought, settle in. Here's some stuff that won't slowly kill your whole family. Probably we'll be right back.

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Alright, now back to Mike Feldstein. It's funny you, this exact same thing happened. I thought we need to test the water in San Jose because I'm from Michigan. We have clean water and. The, there was a, a guy who was next door, uh, who was a doctor, and he was just like, why don't you just get a reverse osmosis filter and then you know your water's clean.

And I was like, this guy, you're onto something. Right. Either test the water and hope that the quality stays consistent and periodically test it every month or just get a machine. City water is cleans everything. Usually not good.

Mike Feldstein: Yeah. Yeah. If you have well water, you have bacteria problems. If you have city water, you're gonna have a lot of chlorine.

Mm-hmm. And potentially way too much fluoride. 'cause think about it, they're [00:32:00] taking like rain water and other people's sewer water and they're disinfecting that water so it doesn't kill you. Yeah. So like, that's what more do, like, people are like mad at the city. The city's trying to make us sick. I don't think so.

They're trying to make it so the bacteria doesn't kill you immediately. Right. And then you have to filter that drinking water. And with air, there's no intermediary. So the rubber from the tires, the chemicals, the restaurants, the forest fire, the glyphosate, the chemicals people are using in their, in their bounce sheets, all the toxic things in the world come into your home.

So I think we're gonna look back in 10 years from now. 25 years ago, dentists didn't use masks or gloves. As a kid, you would just drink straight from the hose and you would just drink tap water and that yummy metal, copper, whatever, penny taste. And then we all learn. You're like, oh, you need to filter your water.

And then we're like, oh, microplastics. And then once you realize it, when you get the plastic bottle, you taste the plastic. Yeah. It's like if you just trust yourself. So I think we're gonna look back and now, and in Asia, like I remember going to Koala Lumpur and other parts of Asia were like, I went to a [00:33:00] bank and every single teller had an air filter in each little room.

Like, and when, when I'd go to the mall and they'd have air purifier stores, so their air awareness is way more head. Why do you think that is? Is is that a dirty city with a lot of air pollution? I think, I think the pollution historically was worse, which increased their air awareness. Sure. They're like, we're getting sick.

I put this machine in my room and I'm breathing better, and I'm sleeping better and I'm feeling better. It's like, why do we filter our water now? 'cause we realized that it was dirty. Taxi drivers in

Jordan Harbinger: Beijing and Shanghai, they'll have this little tiny box that's like this ba it's like the size of your, you know, a fat wallet.

And I'm like, what is this? And they're like, it's an air purifier. And I'm like, I don't want to be the bearer of bad news, but this $9.99 Temu air purifier that you've had in here for a decade is not cleaning all the air in this car with the doors opening every five minutes. Like it's not doing anything. And they're smoking, right?

They smoke their cigarette and they blow it out the window. And they're like, don't worry, I got an air filter. And it's like, oh, China. Yeah. Never change. This reminds me of a Skeptical Sunday episode we did about [00:34:00] expiration dates for food. And one of the subject matter experts, he was just like a food expert of some kind.

I can't remember. Um, I said like, what about this and the dates for this? What about meat? It's dangerous. And he goes, you know what? If you smell meat and it smells really bad, don't eat it. And if you smell meat and it smells fine, it's almost. Almost certainly fine, even if it's expired by a week or two.

And I was like, but why? Why the date? And he, that was what the whole episode was about. But basically, to your earlier point, your nose is really good at telling you whether something is safe to eat or breathe or not, because that's literally the whole point.

Mike Feldstein: But all of these things like tracking your sleep, you know, if you track your sleep and you track your steps, not that you shouldn't, there's a lot of good data that you can get from that stuff.

The downside can be though, is going off the expiry date, you can go down a path of not trusting yourself.

Speaker 4: Yeah.

Mike Feldstein: To be like, do I feel like I need to walk? Like, did I move enough today? Yeah. Uh, let me check my phone. Yeah.

Jordan Harbinger: Yep. We're good. You get obsessed with that. I, I think I've mentioned on the show before that there were [00:35:00] fires outside, so I couldn't go outside and I wanted to get 10,000 steps.

I walked around my kitchen island like. A thousand times. I maybe literally because I wanted 10,000 steps and it was a smaller, it was smaller than this kitchen island. I went around that thing, it took like three and a half hours of me just walking start. My mom was like, are you okay? Because I looked mentally ill.

Right? I was just walking around the kitchen island over and over and over, uh, until I had knee pain and 10,000 steps. It was just, damn. Yeah. And I've sat down and went, why did I do that? How important was it to get those 10,000 steps Before we forget, I want to go back to something you said earlier, which was that some of these artificial smells are, can't remember how you phrased it.

Kind of the new smoking synthetic, like fragrances are the new secondhand smoke. Yes. Because whenever I get in an in an Uber, if they have those rock chunk things that they keep in the little can. That smell terrible, like fake cherry. I tell the driver I have to cancel. I go, oh, I'm sorry I'm allergic to these.

I don't know if I'm really allergic, but I will get a slamming migraine if I, I'm what's allergic for [00:36:00] an hour? Right? Yeah. I don't know. I don't how to prove it. Chris Christmas Tree of death. Yeah. Or if there's one Christmas tree, I'm probably okay If there's eight, which, why are you using that many? If it's expired, throw it away.

Or do you just want eight times the cent? That to me is like, I can't deal with that. It makes me want to vomit. It makes me car sick. So it doesn't surprise me at all that these are bad for you. But I love data because I'm going off of, I feel like these are best, which is actually what you should do. Yeah. I suppose what you, what what we should do.

Yeah. Gla another thing, Glade plugins. Disgusting.

Mike Feldstein: It's the same as the Fabrice stuff.

Jordan Harbinger: Yeah.

Mike Feldstein: And it's heavily correlated to what we were saying before about the mold, because oftentimes the reason that people are desensitized to the mold, also the molds that are really bad for you, smell the worst. What a surprise.

Yeah. Shocking. But the ones that make you sick, you smell and you feel crappy. So because of all this synthetic fragrances, whether it's perfume, cologne, I can smell speed steak or old spice, like across the house. Yeah. It's, yeah. Bad deodorant is, so this is really cool. When cigarette smoking was [00:37:00] very normal and you could do it everywhere.

If you would tell someone to stop smoking, you were just like a bitch. You're an asshole. Yeah. You're the jerk who's running everybody's phone. Yeah. Your, your, it was your preference. Like, Hey, stop smoking. Right. And you know, asshole. Like you are just this annoying person.

Jordan Harbinger: Right.

Mike Feldstein: Then we learned about this little thing called secondhand smoke.

Mm-hmm. Secondhand smoke was one of the greatest marketing campaigns, like positive marketing campaigns of all time because it took it from, you're giving my kid cancer. So telling someone not to smoke was like, you invading on their fun. Mm-hmm. But when you realized that the secondhand smoke was just as cancer causing and making you just as sick as the person who was smoking it, that angered you, that galvanized you, that gave you permission to be pissed because now they were impacting you.

Kinda like the COVID stuff. It's like, you know, you're making me sick, right? So when someone else's choice is impacting you, then that gets people kind of fiery and that's how you get a mission and get things moving. Then the reason I call it fragrances of the secondhand smoke is because you're not the one who put that fragrance in the [00:38:00] Uber, right?

In the Airbnb, in the hotel room when you walked in the mall. They're everywhere now. And synthetic fragrances, it's like natural flavors in food. It's like thousands of chemicals. So if you look like anyone could Google it, type in like what chemicals are in cigarettes that are in fragrances, and there's a huge list like, oh my god, formaldehyde being right at the top and benzene.

You should Chad gt this. It's probably like the Venn diagram

Jordan Harbinger: is probably a pretty nice

Mike Feldstein: open, it's very similar like formaldehyde. Benzene would be two of the really big ones, but there's a lot more. So the same stuff is put in the fragrances that's put in the cigarette. I'm actually writing a blog post right now on this, and the, the AI image that I got generated was a guy smoking a Glade plugin.

So there's good news and bad news. I always tell people, I'm like, the only bad thing that happens if you put a Jaspr in your home or in your bedroom is you will become an air snob. And they're like, ha ha, I want to become an air snob. Yeah. I'm like, yeah, you do. So all of a sudden you're gonna go to like friends' homes and family's homes, like your home stinks and you didn't notice it before.

It's a great way to make friends. Well, your home

Jordan Harbinger: smells like shit. Yeah. [00:39:00] How did not get invited back to Thanksgiving? Your home stinks.

Mike Feldstein: But things will bother you though. You're gonna be asking people to open windows and doors all the time. Yeah, it's an air problem. It's

Jordan Harbinger: December in Michigan, we're not opening the doors, Jordan.

Mike Feldstein: So your olfactory system is a fancy way of saying like you're smelling system. Yeah. So get this, when you smell something delicious, you start salivating. Sure. So I learned this from Dr. Scha Patel. Not sure if you know him, but he's great. He helps people lose a lot of weight and change their whole health and everything.

And a lot of it is by how you eat. So he's like never eat unless you're salivating. The idea is like that. The salivation is a very normal part of the process. That's what happens when you smell the food. Then the saliva tells your gut like, yo, this is what food's coming. I see some steak, some broccoli start preparing the enzymes to break down and absorb the nutrients of whatever's coming.

So I've heard the stats vary, but 50% roughly of the enzymes that get created in your gut are from your olfactory system. Huh? From your ability to smell. So if you've [00:40:00] been smelling fragrances, whether that's from the speed stick or the cologne or the perfume or the Christmas tree, I'm getting ready

Jordan Harbinger: to digest some ban or whatever the hell those is called.

No, your,

Mike Feldstein: your body doesn't know food's coming.

Jordan Harbinger: Oh. Because it's masking all that.

Mike Feldstein: It's masked. So all of a sudden your ability to absorb nutrients is completely blended. Yeah. Your ability to absorb the nutrients and process it all. So it's huge and it impacts your, your weights and it impacts your nutrients.

So what happens is, and that's why I actually started to smell my food more closely. Like when you take your food, it's amazing. Put the food to your your nose and take a few deep breaths through your nose. If there's a few different things on the plate, smell each thing slowly. All of a sudden you'll feel like a rush of saliva gets created.

Jordan Harbinger: This is such a funny thing to do in front of other people. But yeah, I, okay,

Mike Feldstein: I'm following. I mean, people pray anyway. Like what is prayer? Like? Have a moment of gratitude. Add a little smell. I had a little, give it a little sniff. Okay. Try it once. Smell your food and you'll feel just a rush of saliva get created.

It's like, whoa. So your olfactory system regenerates every 30 to 60 days. [00:41:00] So what does that mean? Basically, the neurons in your nose that are blunted from all the fragrances in your modern life, when you stop using synthetic products and you start filtering your at home, your ability to smell in 30 to 60 days is completely regenerated.

That's interesting. So now all of a sudden you can smell food, you start salivating more. I find it eat way less. And the air snob thing is not just a placebo because you are. System is much clearer and your neurons are replaced from all those fragrances and the friz effect, that was blunt again. 'cause it doesn't just stunt it in the moment.

That was my next question. There's a residual effect so it, it

Jordan Harbinger: permanently damage, it can permanently damage those up to two months. I did not know that. That's great. I just

Mike Feldstein: figured all this was really poorly understood. I didn't think people actually, but it's amazing. So there's a brand that I love called Primally Pure.

They make really good deodorants and other products. They have a regenerative farm in Temecula, so they make all their own products. When you start using like a, a better cleaner deodorant for a couple weeks, all of a sudden those speed sticks are like repulsive. I could never stand that

Jordan Harbinger: stuff. Even the, I [00:42:00] think we were talking in the car really expensive, you know, French perfume or cologne.

I can smell it and I can go, this is good stuff and if it's cheap or deodorant or whatever, I can smell that. It's cheap. And I think it's probably just the chemicals they use. If cologne or perfume has gone bad, I can smell that. I didn't. Most people don't know that that stuff goes bad. You can tell a three-year-old bottle of cologne or perfume from a fresh one and it's because the chemistry changes.

And so my friend, a girl that I dated when I was in New York a long, a million years ago, she was like a French nose, right? So she smelled different perfumes and ingredients and designed the fragrances. And she told me that what was the only other person that she knew who wasn't working with her that could smell all these different things.

So this is not a blessing, uh, it's not a humble brag because mostly I'm just smelling really disgusting things or comes in handy on the subway, right? It's enhanced sense of smell, but really cheap fragrances give me a headache. They almost taste bad, if I can phrase it that way. And they burn my throat or my nose getting a headache [00:43:00] about that.

That

Mike Feldstein: lemon glade thing. Yeah, there's no lemons in there.

Jordan Harbinger: There's no lemons in there, right? Exactly. It's funny how like the

Mike Feldstein: word chemicals is bad. Natural flavors is a really nice word for chemicals. Mm-hmm. And fragrances too. So I'm here to make you realize, when you're saying fragrances, you're typically just saying chemicals.

Chemicals,

Jordan Harbinger: yeah. Well everything is a chemical. So there's the other side of that. But yes, basically fair, good

Mike Feldstein: air should basically smell like nothing. Yeah. Or like nature, like cedar, like pine, like Like what outside smells like close to nothing. Close to nothing. Yeah, exactly. So no essential oil diffusers.

There are good oils are

Jordan Harbinger: there? Yeah. Because I would think oil in the air is bad generally.

Mike Feldstein: I mean, I'd rather do it outside or open my windows or scrubbing my air. Yeah. But if you do that, you can get away with a little bit more.

Jordan Harbinger: Yeah. Clean air for me is just, it's become more and more important as time goes on.

Just 'cause I, I'm in that room all the, in my office, in my studio all day. I've got electronics in there. I don't know what that does. I used to be, um, in a room with a monitor that I think generated a lot of ozone. 'cause it could, you could smell it and it would make me like, I didn't love being in there all day with that.

And so having fresh [00:44:00] airflow and things like that. But part of that could have been CO2 and I'm wondering about CO2 levels because I feel like when I'm in that closed room for a while, a couple hours, let's say I do a three hour podcast in my studio, I start to feel tired and I'll turn the fan on because I think I'm hot.

And then eventually that sort of circulates air.

Mike Feldstein: Do you have the C two monitor feel better for No, I'm gonna leave you one.

Jordan Harbinger: Yeah, please. Because I bet you I'm just breathing all the oxygen out. I'm gonna leave you one.

Mike Feldstein: I got one here. I take one everywhere I go. Yeah, yeah. That I bring 'em on planes, I bring 'em on.

I everywhere I go. So

Jordan Harbinger: that room is soundproof, which means that air does not go in and out under the door. It does not go through the return unless the HVAC is on, which it never is 'cause it's California. I bear it. Almost never need it. Unless it's hot as balls or somehow cold, the HVAC is off. And if I'm in there for three hours, man, it's yawn city And I used to just think, oh, I'm, I need more caffeine.

No. Or I'm tired from talking. But I'll be in there doing emails and it's like, nope. Um, it's 10:00 AM and I'm already like beat and I come in here, do a lap on the living room and I'm a new man. And [00:45:00] so I'm convinced it's something with the CO2 and you

Mike Feldstein: can get a vent, a very, very quiet vent that will just vent directly outside and then it will just pull air in from the rest of your home and that will make a big difference.

So's a good idea. We'll give you a CO2 sensor.

Jordan Harbinger: Yeah, thanks. And

Mike Feldstein: you

Jordan Harbinger: can track it. I'm so curious now 'cause I was doing a, a, a little bit of a talk with my friend who's like a breath work person. It's just ironic to me that we are obsessed with like breath work and yoga and then it's, but then like you, the air, you breathe outside of that 20 minute burst, screw it, whatever.

And a

Mike Feldstein: lot of people are doing breath work in moldy rooms with high CO2 with like

Jordan Harbinger: plugin mask in the de scent. Yeah, exactly. So I know that that air quality, that CO2 has gotta mess. And that's why everybody sleeps on planes.

Mike Feldstein: I always fall asleep on planes. Yes. So CO2, uh, is typically 1800. So outdoor CO2 is like a little over 400.

Indoor, 600 to 800 is normal. At a thousand, the brain fog starts kicking in. Planes are typically 1800, 2200. By the way, planes have some of the cleanest air of anywhere because they cycle it in the fil If if filtration wasn't amazing, everyone would get sick every time.

Jordan Harbinger: Yeah, that's what I [00:46:00] thought. Yeah.

Mike Feldstein: So very clean, like scrubbed air, but very high carbon dioxide.

Jordan Harbinger: Is that just because of the, it's so bad they're not bringing

Mike Feldstein: in much fresh air. Energy efficiency.

Jordan Harbinger: How are they filtering the air, cycling the air? If it's not, if they're not bringing in the air,

Mike Feldstein: I mean they're able to recycle it to be as energy efficient as possible. If they were breathing in more and more cold air, the heating costs would be pretty high.

Jordan Harbinger: Oh, so they're not

Mike Feldstein: bringing in

Jordan Harbinger: outside air

Mike Feldstein: on a plane. They're

Jordan Harbinger: just scrubbing the interior air of the plane. Yeah. I did not know that. That's gross. I'd rather, that's something I could have. Could have.

Mike Feldstein: But the CO2 is high and that makes you really tired. So if anyone's in like, you know, in an, whether you're in an elevator or a classroom or an office that, or if you're at a house party mm-hmm.

And you're just like, I just need to go outside and get a breath of fresh air. Pay attention to, if you're in an indoor space with a bunch of people and then when you go outside and take that first breath, you're like, ah, yeah. And I wish I could tell you Jaspr will solve this. It will not. Yeah. That's a, you need fresh air.

It needs to vent out. And I think like with all the climate stuff, the thing that they should really be pointing their finger at is the carbon dioxides going up. 'cause like it used to be [00:47:00] 150 a few hundred years ago, it's going up by two or three a year. When they call like carbon gases, it's so unrelatable.

But if you put anybody in like a closet with five people and they made it feel stuffy, you're like on this path. In 50 years outside is gonna feel like that recording studio in terms of stuff you're like, now that is a scary thing that makes me want to take action.

Jordan Harbinger: That's scary because it means I, I mean, my brain just doesn't work as good in that condition.

Mike Feldstein: Nothing works that good. So

Jordan Harbinger: we're all gonna have brain CO2 brain fog. Oh yeah. I don't know how fast

Mike Feldstein: we can evolve, but probably not that

Jordan Harbinger: fast. Oof. Yeah. Probably not that fast. What about sleep? I've noticed that when I sleep with a window open, I just sleep better. And I don't think it's white noise. I think it's gotta be the air.

Mike Feldstein: So yeah, that's why the ingredients of a good sleep, usually a comfortable bed, good pillow, hopefully non-toxic linens, clean air, cool air and quiet. And if any one of those things is off, you're gonna have a bad sleep. Like your sleep quality is only as good as the weakest link. So you can have the most comfortable bed in the world.

But if it's really hot, yeah, or really loud, or [00:48:00] the air is really dry or really humid. Clean air is a huge deal though. I always tell people, like, if you're buying one Jaspr. Put it in your bedroom. Fan speed three and dark mode. You can get the air about 30 times cleaner in the bedroom. So fresh air is good with a window, especially if the CO2 is high, but scrubbing the air is like essential.

So we did a study with 150 people using Ora Rings last year. So we gave 150 people Jasprs in exchange for one month of sleep data. The average person slept 25 minutes more per night, 18% more deep sleep. HRV scores went up a little bit and people fell asleep five minutes faster. Because think about it, the average indoor air is five to 10 times dirtier than outside.

So if you think about it at night, you're sleeping. You're not drinking water. You're not eating food, right? Literally, the only thing that's keeping you alive is the air. When you test the average air inside, you're breathing in mold, bacteria, VOCs, bug particulate fragrances, paint fumes, everything. Yeah. So your body is somewhat playing defense.

It's dealing with all that stuff. When you turn your [00:49:00] bedroom into a clean air sanctuary, your body can heal itself if you get out of the way. What about babies and kids? Are they more susceptible to dirty air than adults? Average adults, so you eat three pounds of food a day, two or three liters of water, and you breathe 17,000 liters of air.

Adults breathe about 15 to 20,000 times a day. Toddlers breathe about 60,000 times a day, and newborns can breathe a hundred thousand times a day. So their respiratory rate's much higher. So they're breathing more, their lungs are smaller, their immune system is less refined, so. That would probably be the case there.

Jordan Harbinger: It is a toxic world out there. How about a breath of fresh air from those that make this show possible? We'll be right back. This episode is sponsored in part by Jaspr. Quick side note, the guest today, Mike Feldstein, he's the guy who created Jaspr, which we have all over the house because it works so well.

I'm not just saying that 'cause he is here. We've tested a ton of different air purifiers over the years. Mike came up with Jaspr after working on home restorations after wildfires, so he knows what bad air really looks like, smells like [00:50:00] does to you. He basically realized the stuff people buy for their homes, it's just not on the same level as what's used commercially.

So he built Jaspr to bridge that. Industrial level performance, but it's quiet, it's efficient. Something you don't mind having out in your living room. What I like is how it reacts. You cook, the air changes, it ramps up wildfire, smoke rolls in, it kicks into gear. It's also been great for allergies. My whole family breathes just a little bit easier with these things running.

Last year they sold out. When he was on the show, people had to wait and their inventory is actually running a little bit low again. Now is really a good time to beat the rush. It's also the best deal, so if you want to check it out, jaspr.co/jordan is the link, code JORDAN gets you 25% off. But honestly, even if Mike weren't here, I swear I'd still be talking about it and I have it before it's that good.

That's jaspr.co/jordan, code JORDAN. This episode is sponsored in part by Airbnb. I've been so burned out cranking out content lately that all I can think about is travel. There's just something about stepping out of your routine that hits the reset button like nothing else. I got a trip to Patagonia coming up, which I'm ridiculously [00:51:00] excited about.

It's that magic of meeting new people, trying foods you can't pronounce, exploring new cities. That's really what travel's about, frankly, not the checklist or the perfect itinerary, but the experiences and connections you make along the way. Those moments end up being worth more than anything you buy, which got me thinking while you're off exploring, your home is just sitting there empty.

Why not host it on Airbnb while you're away? If you ever considered hosting, but you were worried, maybe it'd be too much to manage. Airbnb's co-host network can help with Airbnb's co-host network. You can hire a local co-host to manage everything from creating your listing and messaging guests to onsite support and even design and styling.

So while you're away, you can rest easy. Knowing your home is in good hands and your guests are happy, it's a smart way to turn your space into a source of additional income without adding to your plate. If you've ever thought about hosting but you want a little help, find a co-host at airbnb.com/host.

This episode is also sponsored in part by Shopify. I've got a lot of friends who run businesses. Every single one of them who sells online uses Shopify. [00:52:00] They've even shown me the dashboard. You can see all your sales metrics. You've run your store right from your phone, which is pretty awesome. So when a friend and I launched our own e-commerce business recently, of course, we went straight to Shopify.

That's the sound of another sale on Shopify. The platform powering millions of businesses around the world. Shopify runs about 10% of all e-commerce in the us. What makes it great is how easy it is to get going. You build a store with hundreds of beautiful templates, tweak everything to fit your brand, and use Shopify's built in AI tools to write product descriptions, headlines, even enhance your product photos, and when it's time to grow.

Shopify's got you covered with marketing tools, inventory management, shipping returns, all the stuff that usually gives you a headache. So if you're ready to sell, you're ready for Shopify.

Jen Harbinger: Turn your big business idea into with Shopify on your side. Sign up for your $1 per month trial and start selling today at  shopify.com/jordan. Go to shopify.com/jordan.

Jordan Harbinger: If you like this episode of the show, I invite you to do what other smart and considerate listeners do, which is take a moment, support the amazing sponsors who make this show possible. [00:53:00] All of the deals, discount codes, and ways to support the show are searchable and clickable over at jordanharbinger.com/deals.

You can also email us if you can't find a code. We'd love to help you with it. I'm jordan@jordanharbinger.com. Yes, it is that important that you support those who support the show. Now for the rest of my conversation with Mike Feldstein, I always gift people. An air filter. Uh, usually get 'em a Jaspr when they kid.

It's a good baby kid. Yeah, I kind of figured it it would be, because one thing I noticed that's kind of, I dunno, ironic is people will have a baby, right? And so one of the first things they do is they go, we just repainted the nursery. And I'm like, that's a nice thought, but now you've got this paint, latex paint off gassing in the room.

And they go, don't worry, the baby's a month out. And I'm like, still. And then it's like, okay, well, but then you put all the baby blankets and the pillow and the stuffed animals and the crib that you assembled is all in there getting all of that stuff stuck to it or whatever. And yeah. And the diaper pale.

And the diaper pale. Okay. I hadn't thought about that. I'm

Mike Feldstein: on a war against diaper pals and I got a new baby at home right [00:54:00] now. Yeah.

Jordan Harbinger: Oh, that's right. Yeah.

Mike Feldstein: So anybody who is having a baby soon or is gonna have another baby, I would recommend five, six months. I know you like to wait till the end, but as early as you can.

If you want to paint and do all that stuff, do it as early as you can. You know, don't get a used bed, but if you can get a crib secondhand. That would be a good idea because it's already off gassed. What's Offgassing? I probably should have explained that. So Offgassing is, think about that new car smell, new home smell.

You bring in that bed, you get that whiff of formaldehyde. That stays for a while.

Jase Sanderson: Yeah. Yeah.

Mike Feldstein: Offgassing smells basically Formaldehyde. Yeah. Okay. And it could take a year to, for something to off Gass. And when things are manufactured in a factory, as soon as it's assembled, they wrap it up tight. They wrap plastic, they ship it up.

Yeah. And then you open it in your home and bam. So little baby just got born in a hospital, by the way, I've been saying this a lot and it's been a lot lately, but if anyone's we're local in Austin, so if anyone is having a baby in a hospital or a home birth in Austin, we will [00:55:00] bring a Jaspr to the hospital, to your birthing suite for free and you get to take it home.

That's a gift. That's Jaspr's gift. That's pretty cool to the next generation. I believe that it's the adult's responsibility to give their kids clean air. And part of the mission at Jaspr's, if the parents aren't gonna do it, we'll do it for you. Hmm. So, and that way that kid's gonna be breathing clean air.

So if you're in Austin, that is a little perk that we offer. Huh? Put those diaper pales, man. If it smells like shit, it is shit. And if it's shit, it's bacteria. Put the diaper pale outside of the baby's room and then empty it. If you're gonna use it, empty it every single day. And if you still disagree, then I have a little challenge for you.

Put it in your bedroom. Put it in your bedroom One night. Exactly. One night. See what it feels like to have dirty diapers in your bedroom. And if you can't tolerate it, it's funny, like people love their babies and you do ev anything for your babies, and then you literally put them six feet away from a poop canister.

Yeah. And I like that as an example because it's like. It just shows how much things are just a lack of awareness. Yeah. All you have to do is be told that once and no one argues that. Everyone's like, oh shit. No [00:56:00] pun intended. Literally. Yeah. Yeah. Geez, that is gross. How do, how do people take advantage of the the free Jaspr birth?

It's just go to our website, contact us. Okay. We'll tell us a week or a month or however much the more heads up you can, and then we'll either send it to your home or we'll drop it off at the hospital and then you take it home. That's your baby's first gift. That's pretty cool. It's pretty nice.

Jordan Harbinger: So people who heard the last episode that we did, I dunno, a couple years ago now.

They ordered the Jaspr after the show. A lot of people did, and they said that it was backorder, which, you know, I'll pat myself on the back. Maybe We ended up selling plenty of Jasprs. You did. Did you end up shifting your manufacturing? I mean, this is a, a little inside baseball. I don't know how much people care, but I'm curious because manufacturing stuff is a huge pain.

You have tariffs now, like, how's that, how's that all shifted?

Mike Feldstein: It's been a two and a half year process to add a second factory. Mm-hmm. It's just not very responsible business to have one factory, especially when people are trusting you to have that filter there every six months. Mm-hmm. So we have added redundancy to our manufacturing.

We're trying to build a factory in Texas. It is so hard. [00:57:00] Yeah, yeah, yeah. It is so, so hard to manufacture here. From the cost of land. And you just think about, like, when you think about it, you just imagine like the labor and then you're like, wait, no. The land is way more expensive, right? Sure. Like when you look at a, a commercial lease for a building, it's like 50 to 60,000 a month.

Then you're like, in China it's 5,000. So you don't realize it's the real estate, then it's the cost to build the building. Then it's the electrical cost. So it's not just like the labor and can we get steel and, and paying people more money. It's the whole thing that makes it nearly impossible. There's a, during COVID, a guy also

Jordan Harbinger: from Texas who's a, a friend of a mutual friend of ours, he wanted to make masks domestically, and he was like pulling out all the stops, like, how do we do this?

How do we get the material? I need this. So I was helping him source special kinds of fabric for these masks. And one of the ways that he got stuck was. It's very, very expensive to buy machines, import machines, and put them on enough land to make it worthwhile. In the United States, even in Texas, where it's like, Hey, we're not California.

We don't have all these [00:58:00] dumb rules and regulations that are stopping business. It's like

Mike Feldstein: it's still 10 times the price. And in China, they have these companies that do basically like third party skilled manufacturing folk. Yeah. So you can call and have 5,000 people show up who know how to do assembly.

We don't have that. We have that for like construction, kind of like temp workers and stuff, but not so much for manufacturing. Wow. So they're just so well built and it's very frustrating. Yeah. Because like every bone in our bodies want to make the product here. Yeah. But it is very, very difficult.

Jordan Harbinger: Yeah.

Mike Feldstein: But we will be able to, we will be able to do it.

It's probably gonna take us about two years to manufacture in Texas. We will be able to do it. Also, America only can make 20% of the steel that we need as a country.

Jordan Harbinger: Oh, I didn't know that.

Mike Feldstein: Yeah.

Jordan Harbinger: Where do we get

Mike Feldstein: it? Canada, like Turkey and like a bunch of different countries. I figured we bought it from Canada.

Yikes. No, it's coming from all over. But America can only produce 20% of the steel that we need in the country and it takes 25 years to set up more steel production.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:59:00] That sounds like a national security issue.

Mike Feldstein: It's not good.

Jordan Harbinger: Yeah. Yikes. Especially like when you put it, the China can have 5,000 people show up overnight and assemble things and we can't do that here.

And also we don't have steel. Somebody emailed me about this and make me feel better or worse and we'll do a show on it. Man. Thank you. This is really interesting stuff. I never really think about air quality. Like I said, after the first episode, it was something I just never focus on before I let you go.

You're building a school that's kind of a departure from Clean Air or is it? I don't know. No, it's not.

Mike Feldstein: Okay. So my daughter Aria, she's five now. When she first started gonna school, she was two and a half. And when she started, first week, she comes home boogers, stuffy, nose, cough, sick. Yeah. She got better for like two days sick again.

And all of us were sick constantly. She wasn't in bubble wrap. So basically the doctor reading online, talking to doctors like it's totally normal. Yeah, till your child's like seven. They have to get every infection and build up their immune system. I'm like, I don't understand. Because she was on planes and we were at hotels and we were traveling.

Like she didn't get sick there. She's been [01:00:00] exposed to a lot of people. Why schools? You know, I'm picking her up from school and I'm like, literally, if you designed a classroom to make kids as sick as possible, they got like a perfect grade. So think about the way, the way the school was built, first of all two grade plugins.

I would unplug it every single day when I would pick her up and I would like hide it and every day it would be re-plugged in. They have toilets in the class with no ventilation, so there's two toilets with a diaper pale. No window, no fans. Windows that don't open, carpets that don't get cleaned. Horrible fluorescent lighting, harsh chemicals and cleaning products that they're using after hours.

We switched Aria's School and we gave the school Jasprs for every classroom. And instantly Aria stopped getting sick. What a surprise. Because like when we Kids are gross. They are really gross. Boogers and poops. Yeah. And breathing and coughing. They get each other sick all the time. I started reading more and more into this and there was a study done in Finland where they put air purifiers in 50% of the classrooms and absentee rates and teachers and students drop by 30%.[01:01:00]

They put air purifiers in half the classes. The classes that were cleaning the air, absentee rates drop by 30%. So the school is called Kindling Academy. We purchased the school in our neighborhood in Austin. The whole purpose of the school is we're gonna try to reduce absentee rates by 50% by creating the healthiest school in America.

So what are we doing? Jaspr's, in every class, whole building water filtration, we're getting lighting systems that actually match the circadian rhythm of the sun. So throughout the day, the frequency of the lights will change. And if it's a cloudy day or a sunny day pick on your iPhone. Kinda like that.

Yeah. But like it will match the weather. So if it's a sunny day versus the cloudy day, the frequency of the lighting will match the sun that day. Huh. That's kind of cool. The classroom, what does that do

Speaker 4: again?

Mike Feldstein: Well, it's just unnatural for your body to go outside and then come inside to this very artificially lit environment.

Like your body's like tripping out, doesn't know what to do. I wonder if I can do, these are all like what it Philips hue bulbs I would recommend, um, as a low hanging fruit. I would set them up to go red in the evening.

Jordan Harbinger: They do, they go red and they get really dim in the, so that's like a pretty good way.

They go orange and then they go red or something like that. Yeah.

Mike Feldstein: So the idea is [01:02:00] public schools are funded on attendance. That's why they have all these truancy laws. So you can't miss more than two weeks of public school. Or they like do hearings and you get in trouble and all that. 'cause that's how they're funded.

So our thought process is if we can reduce absentee rates by 30, 40, 50%, it becomes financially aligned for the public schools to create healthier buildings. I see. Wow. That's smart. And we were trying to find a good school for our kids, and they were either like awesome and outdoor and kind of like nature hippie schools.

Yeah. We got one of those. But like they wouldn't teach 'em to read. Yeah. Yeah. You can't do math, but you can climb trees. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Or it was completely the other side where it's like they're teaching them to be these little baby geniuses and they don't get to go outside at all. Right. I'm like, it's not that much to ask for both.

Mm-hmm. And like. Kids should be exci. Like kids love kids, why don't they love school? School should be fun. So we're like, how do we take a school where they're mostly outside and we're gonna build screened in porches around the whole school so they can kind of have that indoor, outdoor, fresh air environment.

So basically pay teachers, well make really healthy environments, track the attendance, track the sick rates, and inspire people to try to [01:03:00] do the same.

Jordan Harbinger: Yeah, that's pretty interesting. I, I've never really thought about schools being super unhealthy and also that you could make it financially, you could be basically, you could make it profitable or at least financially aligned for them to have the right kind of lighting.

Right. Kind of water, right. Kind of air. Yeah.

Mike Feldstein: So we're gonna, and uh, by the way, this is. Another thing. Right now we're only doing it in Texas. 'cause we got overwhelmed on the last few podcasts. Yeah. But any school in Texas, if your kids are in private schools, message us and we'll donate Jasprs to every, uh, class in your kid's school.

Nice. We can only do it with private schools because public schools are a pain in the ass to deal with. 'cause you need like 16 lawyers to clear having a device in the classroom. Yes. But if your kid's in a school or if you're a teacher or a principal yourself and you want clean air in your school, hit us up.

We got the babies. We got the kids.

Jordan Harbinger: Mike, thank you very much man. I, I appreciate it. I always, it's one of those topics that I just didn't think I would care about until you realize it affects your sleep. It affects your health, it affects your muscle growth. It affects your cognition. It affects your, for me, I'm, I know everyone says this, but I'm like actually a DHD and it's hard enough for me to [01:04:00] focus.

Having low oxygen content or smells bugging me is like the less, I just don't need more distractions. I, so once you find out that air is kind of connected to like every No, I

Mike Feldstein: think aspect of your performance. I had this recent insight that was, I think the reason. That people don't pay attention to airs 'cause it's free.

Yeah. So like food you like, you get really hungry and then you have to go buy it. Like you physically have to. Yeah, you get thirsty, you have to go get it. But air is so abundant and, and free that you're not really like thinking about the quality of it and how it impacts you and that it's not all the same.

So once we got aware of better food and better water, we started to take action. Also though, with water, you

Jordan Harbinger: taste it and you go, yuck, something's not right. But very, unless you, like you said before with mold, unless it's like holy crap, what's wrong with your home?

Mike Feldstein: Yeah.

Jordan Harbinger: It just smells mostly like nothing and or it smells the same equal bad for years at a

Mike Feldstein: time and you just ignore it.

So, yo, the interesting thing about this timing is, so yeah, last time I was on the podcast was about five or six weeks before Black Friday. Oh yeah. And we were back ordered two months. Yeah. Whoops. Yeah. On Black Friday. [01:05:00] No, dude, it's awesome. Code Jordan was a big hit. Yeah. Yeah. This time No code Jordan guys.

Okay. Because it's already Black Friday right now. Mm-hmm. So, um, I think for about one more week it's $400 off on Jaspr. So Jaspr's normally 1199, and right now it's 7 99. Mm-hmm. After Black Friday season though, if you use code Jordan, like let's say you're listening to this episode weeks or months later.

Yeah. Um, code Jordan will forever be $200 off. Nice. So that will never go away, but right now happened to be the cheapest time that Jaspr will ever be. We basically don't ever do sales except for the week of Black Friday. And that is right now. So Jaspr's our $400 off right now for about one more week.

So we might be sold out by the time you heard this, but if we are, it'll be a few weeks or so. And I firmly believe that cleaning up the air quality in your home is by far the lowest effort. You know, you don't have to take us on every day. You don't have to journal, you don't have to go to the gym. Like do those things too.

Yeah. You don't have to meditate, you don't have to. Cold plunge. Very [01:06:00] few things are so good for your health and your energy and your sleep. That don't take willpower every single day. Right. That's why Me too. My willpower is not great. This is one thing I do. So the website is js p r.co. Mm-hmm. And if you really do like using code Jordan, throw it in there.

Maybe it will save you a couple extra bucks. We'll see.

Jordan Harbinger: Yeah. Nice. We'll link to it in the show notes. Normally I don't allow people to pitch like that, but whatever. I was gonna do it for you. It's Black Friday. It's Friday. It's Black Friday. Black Friday. Those bills, Mike, pay those bills Black Friday.

Thanks for coming in, man. All right. Imagine facing a rare, incurable disease and finding out that AI could repurpose an FDA approved drug as a potential cure. That's the breakthrough achieved by Dr. David Fajgenbaum and the mission of his company.

JHS Trailer: I'll never forget, the doctor walks in the room and says, David, your liver, your kidneys, your bone marrow, your heart and your lungs are all shutting down.

That's it. Like, we've tried everything. There's, there's nothing more that we can do. I was terrified. I was like, had my last rights read to me first, you know, no one thought that it [01:07:00] was even possible that I could survive. You're dying from this horrible disease. Chemotherapy just gave you a little bit of a window, but it's probably gonna come back.

So, you know, what's your game plan to prevent this thing from killing you? Well, the only way to get back is to use the tools that you have. Within reach. I'm like, shit, I've got this horrible disease and the only way that like I might be able to save myself is if I can find a drug that's already at the CVS.

And so my mission then became could I figure out what the hell's going wrong in my immune system? So then maybe I could find a drug that already exists that could treat it. I'm not supposed to be here, like my drug wasn't made for me. It saved my life. It was always there. I am completely on fire about this idea that there are drugs at your nearby CBS, your nearby Walgreens that could help more diseases and more people.

But the incentives aren't aligned for us to do that. So we created every cure a couple years ago because we believe that every drug should be utilized for every disease it possibly can, regardless of, you know, whether it's profitable [01:08:00] or not. 80% of our drugs that can help people today and tomorrow, no one's doing any research whatsoever to figure out more uses for them.

Jordan Harbinger: Tune into episode 1005 of The Jordan Harbinger Show to explore how existing medications are bringing new hope to those confronting elusive illnesses. Huge thanks to Mike for joining us once again. If today's episode made you question everything you're breathing in right now. Good. Because wildfires don't just burn trees.

They leave chemical souvenirs in your lungs for months or even years, and your home is not just a home. It's an ecosystem full of CO2 mold fragments, synthetic fragrances, and VOCs that your body is quietly dealing with in the background. The truth is, clean air is one of the most overlooked pillars of health, cognition and recovery.

We optimize our sleep, we optimize our diet, we optimize our workouts. Some people out here doing cold plunges at 4:00 a.m. but we ignore the literal thing that we breathe 20,000 plus times per day. Links to Mike, the new Jaspr research, and more will all be in the show notes. Share this episode with somebody who lives in a moldy [01:09:00] apartment and calls it character, a parent who wants better for their kid than fluorescent lit brain haze, or a friend who thinks synthetic lavender is healthy. Advertisers deals, discount codes, ways to support the show, all on the website at jordanharbinger.com/deals. Please consider supporting those who support the show. Also, our newsletter Wee Bit Wiser.

The idea here is to give you something specific and practical that'll have an immediate impact on your decisions, your psychology, your relationships in under two minutes. And if you haven't signed up yet, come check it out. It's a great companion to the show. jordanharbinger.com/news is where you can find it.

Don't forget about Six Minute Networking as well over at sixminutenetworking.com. I'm at Jordan Harbinger on Twitter and Instagram. You can also connect with me on LinkedIn, and this show is created in association with PodcastOne. My team is Jen Harbinger, Jase Sanderson, Robert Fogarty, Tadas Sidlauskas, Ian Baird, and Gabriel Mizrahi.

Remember, we rise by lifting others. The fee for the show is you share it with friends. When you find something useful or interesting, the greatest compliment you can give us is to share the show with those you care about. In the meantime, I hope you [01:10:00] apply what you hear on the show so you can live what you learn, and we'll see you next time.