You’ve met someone who checks your boxes for marriage material, but there’s one problem: medical issues may mean they’ve only got three years left to live. Should you propose and hope for a miracle? We’ll examine this and more here on Feedback Friday!
And in case you didn’t already know it, Jordan Harbinger (@JordanHarbinger) and Gabriel Mizrahi (@GabeMizrahi) banter and take your comments and questions for Feedback Friday right here every week! If you want us to answer your question, register your feedback, or tell your story on one of our upcoming weekly Feedback Friday episodes, drop us a line at email@example.com. Now let’s dive in!
On This Week’s Feedback Friday, We Discuss:
- You’ve met someone who checks your boxes for marriage material, but there’s one problem: medical issues that may mean they’ve only got three years left to live. Should you propose and hope for a miracle?
- Your spouse went on a quest of self-improvement, and now follows a so-called “life coach” who dispenses what certainly seems to be a steady buffet of snake oil with an exorbitant price tag. How can you wake them up to the fact that this is probably a scam?
- You have three years before you’re able to retire from teaching — a job you once loved, but students, parents, the community, and the administration are more entitled and demanding than they were when you first started. Three years seems like forever to endure a job you now hate. What can you do to make it to the finish line intact?
- You’ve received a sizable inheritance, but you understand how quickly money dissipates when you try to throw it at every problem you want to solve. Are you wise for wanting to use the money to create multiple streams of income so you are able to help people more confidently in the future, or just stingy?
- As a freelance consultant, how can you set boundaries that ensure you’re not working for hours more than clients are willing to pay?
- Have any questions, comments, or stories you’d like to share with us? Drop us a line at firstname.lastname@example.org!
- Connect with Jordan on Twitter at @JordanHarbinger and Instagram at @jordanharbinger.
- Connect with Gabriel on Twitter at @GabeMizrahi.
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- Glenfiddich: Find out more about the Glenfiddich #Richest25 here
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Miss our two-parter with former Westboro Baptist Church spokesperson Megan Phelps-Roper? Make sure to catch up starting with episode 302: Megan Phelps-Roper | Unfollowing Westboro Baptist Church Part One here!
Resources from This Episode:
- Spencer Roberts | The Dirty Truth About Corporate Greenwashing | Jordan Harbinger
- Metta World Peace | Mettaphorically Speaking | Jordan Harbinger
- The Fault In Our Stars | Prime Video
- Baby Driver | Prime Video
- The Secret Annex | Anne Frank House
- How to Avoid Scams | Deep Dive | Jordan Harbinger
- How to Save Yourself and Loved Ones from Scams | Jordan Harbinger
- Why Hustle Culture Makes You Miserable (And How to Break Out of It) | Jordan Harbinger
- Behind the Curve | Netflix
601: Should I Marry My Dying Girlfriend? | Feedback Friday
[00:00:00] Jordan Harbinger: Special thanks to our sponsor Glenfiddich single malt scotch whisky. Lately, you've heard me talk about Glenfiddich in challenging traditional notions commonly portrayed in culture, of what it means to be wealthy and live a life of. Glenfiddich believes that beyond the material, a life of wealth and riches is about family, community, values, and fulfilling work. These are the values that led Glenfiddich to become the world's leading single malt scotch whisky. On Feedback Friday, we are always trying to help you solve problems that get in the way of you living your richest life. More from our partners at Glenfiddich coming up later in the show.
[00:00:33] Welcome to Feedback Friday. I'm your host Jordan Harbinger. As always, I'm here with Feedback Friday producer, the Papi Chulo, who takes you to school-o, Gabriel, that was the dumbest name that I've ever come up with, for you. Gabriel Mizrahi is also here. On The Jordan Harbinger Show, we decode the stories, secrets, and skills of the world's most fascinating people and turn their wisdom into practical advice that you can use to impact your own life and those around you. We want to help you see the Matrix when it comes to how these amazing people think and behave. Our mission is to help you become a better informed, more critical thinker. So you can get a deeper understanding of how the world works and make sense of what's really happening, even inside your own mind.
[00:01:10] If you're new to the show, on Fridays, we give advice to you and answer listener questions. The rest of the week, we have long-form interviews and conversations with a variety of amazing folks from spies to CEOs, athletes, authors, thinkers, and performers.
[00:01:22] This week, we had Spencer Roberts on greenwashing. In order words, why those labels you see on sustainable foods like dolphin-safe tuna and other products, those are often fake. I didn't know this. They used to launder the reputations of big corporations in many cases, which is terrifying and sad. We also spoke to Metta World Peace formerly Ron Artest, who you might remember from the Malice at the Palace, you know, that guy who jumped into the crowd and punched at an NBA game and it turned out to be the wrong fan. It wasn't even the guy that was messing with him. And it was one of the black marks in NBA history. I'm not a sports guy. So of course, with the conversation, we took a different turn. We spoke about mental health, not letting our past define us, quite an interesting character that Metta World Peace. So make sure you've had to listen to everything that we created for you here this week.
[00:02:05] Gabe, what's the first thing out of a mailbag?
[00:02:08] Gabriel Mizrahi: Hey, Jordan and Gabe, I'm a 41-year-old guy living in the south. And I recently left an 18-year marriage with a woman who caused me to distrust all women. The marriage also caused me to only view women as short-term relationship material. Then three months ago, I met a woman who checks all my boxes for what I wanted in a relationship. Now, I'm debating marrying her, but there are a couple of problems. First, she has some serious medical issues that might make her lifespan three years or less. She's also shared a lot of things that trigger her PTSD, which makes a relationship with her difficult. I'm such a mess, guys. Should I marry her with no expectation of how long I'll have with her? Or should I just walk away? Signed, 'Til Death Do Us Part Or Make a New Start.
[00:02:49] Jordan Harbinger: Wow. That is quite a heavy question. Really, really sad. It's basically a grown-up version of The Fault in Our Stars, or whatever — what was that movie about the kids with cancer who fall in love?
[00:03:00] Gabriel Mizrahi: That's the one, The Fault In Our Stars. That's exactly what it's like.
[00:03:04] Jordan Harbinger: I don't watch movies like that. I can't, but you know—
[00:03:07] Gabriel Mizrahi: That's the one where Shailene Woodley and that guy from Baby Driver literally make out in Anne Frank's attic at some, ugh, so cringe, that scene was so bizarre.
[00:03:15] Jordan Harbinger: That's why I don't watch those kinds of — well, no, that's not why, but that's one of the many reasons why I don't watch those movies.
[00:03:19] Gabriel Mizrahi: It's not just the Anne Frank make-out scene.
[00:03:21] Jordan Harbinger: No, no, it's not—
[00:03:22] Gabriel Mizrahi: It's the general genre.
[00:03:23] Jordan Harbinger: It's not the Holocaust sexualization part as much as it is. It's the everything else that makes me not want to see it.
[00:03:29] Gabriel Mizrahi: Fair enough.
[00:03:29] Jordan Harbinger: Yeah. Well, let me start by saying, this is an incredibly tough choice. You meet someone who you really want to be with, but they only have a few years to live. In one way, that makes the whole relationship more meaningful, weirdly more romantic. It's incredibly tragic, but the tragedy almost makes it like more touching. But in another way, I understand how something like this would give you pause. Like, do I really want to sign up for this kind of heartbreak? Is it even fair to get involved with somebody who's going to die soon? Yeah. I'm starting to see why they make movies about this kind of thing. That high stakes stuff here, right?
[00:04:03] First of all, we have to talk about your past for a moment because there's obviously a lot going on there. You were in a relationship that caused you to distrust all women and to only view women as short-term relationship material — we'll get to that in a second — but now you've met this woman you've done a 180. You want to marry her despite her serious health issues. Now, that might actually reflect a lot of growth on your part. And if so, that's great news, but it does seem like a pretty extreme shift to make. Putting your girlfriend aside for a moment, if you had just written to us about your previous marriage, I would tell you work through that experience, figure out what went wrong. Why is it led you to have such a negative view of all women? Which is just unreasonable, of course, whatever went wrong in that marriage. I want you to get super clear on that.
[00:04:50] I would want to get super clear on that if I'm you, because if you want to have a successful relationship with anyone in the future, whether it's this new woman or someone else, you're going to have to unpack these complicated beliefs of yours, and I can promise you that whatever they are, they're showing up in some way in your current relationship. So my advice go to therapy. No surprise there. Start talking about this. Do the forensics on your marriage. You've got to do a post-mortem on this thing. You have lots of good reasons to work on these parts of your life, especially given this huge decision that you're facing now.
[00:05:24] All right, now we can talk about your girlfriend. So this is fascinating. Obviously, the health stuff is just front and center. If you marry this woman, your committing to a short marriage. Taking her through these serious medical issues, dealing with all of the responsibilities that that entails, that's a big role to play. I'm not trying to talk you out of it right off the bat. I just think we have to recognize that this is a lot to take on, for anyone to take on. And I guess, I'm saying this, not just so you're clear about what you're signing up for, but also to appreciate what that commitment would mean for her. If she has a really rough few years ahead, she's going to need a partner who truly loves her, who's not going to run away halfway through or bail at the last moment or stick around, but kind of like quietly resent her and make her life even harder. If you get married, you both need to be on the same page about how you feel, how you're going to deal with everything that the next three years brings up. Because I think, you know, it's probably going to be freaking devastating, although it could be very powerful to be there for somebody literally until the end of their life. Man, Gabe, that is so intense to think about.
[00:06:35] Gabriel Mizrahi: So intense.
[00:06:35] Jordan Harbinger: That is some real life-ish right there. But here's the other thing, your girlfriend, isn't just dealing with her medical stuff. She also has PTSD according to your letter. And that is obviously sad and I hope she's doing okay. But she has some work to do here too, because it's clearly an issue in your relationship. I know that might sound weird to say about somebody who's going to die in the next three years. Maybe her health stuff makes the PTSD just like a footnote in the bigger picture. But I guess I'm confused about how good this relationship actually is. Because you could have said that your girlfriend has PTSD, but you're happy to help her work through it or that it's a challenge, but you love her. So it doesn't matter, but that is not what you said.
[00:07:16] What you said was she has PTSD and that makes a relationship with her difficult. And yet she checks all your boxes. So my advice, and you're probably going to notice a theme here is you need to dig into this. I would get very clear on why you are in this relationship and whether it's actually a healthy relationship for both of you. And what's drawing you to commit in a bigger way, despite these various significant issues.
[00:07:42] Gabe, it's interesting, man. He almost has to put aside the huge question of her life span to be able to see this relationship clearly. Because I get the sense that her diagnosis — and this sounds weird, but hear me out here, it's almost eclipsing all of these other issues that he'd have to acknowledge in a typical relationship. Like this is such a big thing that you can almost gloss over all the other actual problems or it's causing him to overlook the other problems because he feels badly for her which I guess I can understand, but that is not going to make either of them happy at all.
[00:08:17] Gabriel Mizrahi: No, it is not. That is such a good point. Her diagnosis does feel like the main issue here, but it's also kind of obscuring all of these other real issues. Issues that ultimately will determine if this relationship is even a good one, you know, timeline and lifespan aside. You know, Jordan, I'm still thinking about what you said earlier about the fact that he went from only viewing women as short-term partners to now wanting to get married. You're right. Maybe he has grown and if he has fantastic, but the reality is he is considering marrying a woman who will be dying in the next three years.
[00:08:51] This relationship, it has a very real expiration date. I know this is super sad to say out loud. I do not mean to be callous about it whatsoever. But if you were looking for a way to commit to somebody without really having to commit, then choosing someone who's going to die pretty soon, that is kind of a great way to do that. I mean, it is possible that he hasn't changed that much since his marriage ended. He's just found another person whose medical issues make her exactly what he wants, which is in his words, short-term relationship material. The only difference is he's not just treating her that way. She is that way. So it's not as obvious that he's dating somebody who fits that template. Because he's thinking to himself, "Well, look, this is her health stuff. I mean, this is out of my hands," right? But the fact is he's still choosing her. And I got to say it does seem meaningful that the only woman he wants to move forward with in a real way, since the divorce is the one person who, unfortunately, won't be around for very long.
[00:09:42] Jordan Harbinger: Yeah, I had not thought of that, but I think you're on to something. I mean, we don't pick our partners by accident, right? This is like a subconscious thing. That's what I was getting at earlier when I said he needs to unpack what happened in his last marriage. Because whatever that was, it's definitely showing up in this new relationship. But what you just said, I think that might be the thing that's showing up again.
[00:10:04] Gabriel Mizrahi: Yeah, I think it might be when he says that she checks all of his boxes. I believe him. They might be compatible in a lot of ways, maybe even some really, really special ways. But I wonder if one of the main boxes that he's looking to check is the ability to have, you know, one foot in and one foot out to sort of be able to commit to somebody. But to also know that in three years, you know, if things go the way he thinks they're going to go, then he might be free again. And look, I just want to be super clear about this. I'm not saying that his feelings for this woman aren't real or that he doesn't have good intentions. I think he does. But I do think that all of those things are also being informed by these feelings and these beliefs that he doesn't fully appreciate. Those feelings and those beliefs, they go back to his last marriage as you pointed out. But they almost certainly go back further than that as they always do, right? To childhood and all of that. And until you get in touch with that stuff, it's kind of impossible to resolve the conflicts that are holding you back from a real commitment or that are causing you to put people in the same role, time and time again, which in your case is basically intimacy, yes, but intimacy with a shelf-life.
[00:11:07] Jordan Harbinger: Yeah. You nailed it, man. Look, you've got some more to do my friend. We're not saying you shouldn't marry this woman. Maybe you should, maybe it would be a really special three years for both of you, but you need to know why you're making this commitment and a why is with this person. There are still issues in this relationship that y'all need to address no matter what. But the fact that your girlfriend only has a few years to live, that introduces a whole other set of stakes here. So I would make sure that you're ready for that. And that you can really be the partner that your girlfriend deserves.
[00:11:38] I'm really sorry that you guys are facing this intense diagnosis, by the way, that's got to be super sad and overwhelming sometimes. But I also think that with the right approach, it'll be very clarifying. So we're thinking about you guys, we're wishing you the best.
[00:11:51] And you know, who doesn't have a problem committing? Our sponsors' amazing products and services. We'll be right back.
[00:11:59] You're listening to Feedback Friday here on The Jordan Harbinger Show. We'll be right back.
[00:12:03] This episode is sponsored in part by Charles Schwab. If this year has taught us anything, it's that tomorrow may look nothing like today. But Schwab knows that successful financial planning can help propel net worth by 2.7 times. That's why Schwab offers a variety of easy, flexible financial planning on, that can rise to meet any of life's many curve balls. Whether it's making a complimentary retirement plan online or chatting directly with the financial consultants, anyone can look forward to planning with Schwab. Learn more at schwab.com/plan.
[00:12:32] This episode is also sponsored by Grammarly. It's been hectic, wrapping everything up for the end of the year, trying to get everything done before our baby gets here, which is like any second now. Grammarly is great in helping me communicate clearly and kindly even when you're in a hurry. What's the saying, if I had more time, I would've written a shorter letter. And Grammarly makes suggestions as you go. Grammarly helps me, not only find the right words, but also it helps me find new words. You know, the ones that make you sound smart when you're writing an email, I love those. It also works in my email program. It works in my web browser. So I'm not sort of limited to where it can make me sound and appear more intelligent than I really am. Giving end-of-the-year feedback to your employees, Grammarly helps every good job, or a "Houston, we have a problem," pitch perfect. Pitching a big idea to a client who can't stand jargon. Why touch base offline? When you can just meet. Grammarly helps keep it conversational. Don't let all those holiday cards get you stressed. Grammarly can help keep your season's greetings Merry even when the eggnog hasn't kicked in yet. Ooh, that's a good idea.
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[00:14:30] And now back to Feedback Friday on The Jordan Harbinger Show.
[00:14:35] All right. What's next?
[00:14:36] Gabriel Mizrahi: Hey Jordan and Gabe, about two years ago, my wife went in search of, quote-unquote, "making herself better." She went deep into tons of books and podcasts on topics ranging from dieting to positive self-talk to changing her way of thinking about things. This eventually led her to life coaching. She has found one particular life coach that she has gone all in with. About six months ago, my wife started paying $300 a month to meet once a week on Zoom with a life coach who was certified by this life coach to, quote-unquote, "work on herself." She says, it's helpful. Now, she has a strong desire to do the six-month advanced course at a cost of $20,000. I was completely shocked and that's understating it. To give some perspective, this isn't one of the typical situations you've talked about in the past, where a person is on the ropes and they give their life savings to a life coach and hopes of, you know, turning everything around. We're both advanced in our careers and make good money. And we live comfortably below our means. So it's not that she wants to spend $20,000, it's that she wants to spend $20,000 on what seems like a program that teaches you how to get better at drinking snake oil. But at the same time, I've spent quite a bit of money on my hobby over the last couple of years. So I feel like I really can't say no without looking like there's a double standard. Are all of the life coaches like this, just a scam or is there some legitimacy to them? How does a coach justify $20,000 a value for something like this? And how do I get to a place where I'm okay with something like this? Or should I put my foot down? Signed, Looking askance at This Song and Dance.
[00:16:02] Jordan Harbinger: Oh, yeah, this is a little worrisome. As you know, I'm pretty skeptical of 99 percent of life coaches out there. It's not that I don't think people should get coaching. I love good coaching. Obviously, this show wouldn't exist if I didn't believe in working on yourself. It's just that there are so few coaches out there who are actually worth their salt. There's almost no regulation in the coaching industry. The whole field is just rife with bullsh*t and exploitation. I love that your wife is committed to getting better. We all should be, but I do find it interesting that you guys are already doing pretty well and she still wants to be coached. Sure. Maybe this person will take her to the next level and that could be great, but she might also be forking over 20 grand to like a former SoulCycle instructor who washed out of that academy, and who's just going to tell her to eat freaking chia seeds and start bullet journaling every morning. So I get your concern here.
[00:16:57] The first thing I would do, I would really get a sense of whether this coach is legit. And I know that's what you're asking me here. So look them up online. Try to find reviews that are not just testimonials on their website. A lot of people don't realize, for some reason, that the testimonials on people's website are not these impartial reviews, right? They're selected. Those are just marketing. Look for stories on independent forums or social media. Study the coach's curriculum if it even exists. Don't settle for like, "We're going to supercharge your productivity," or, "Develop a long-term vision," or whatever they tell you. Look for specific exercises, specific concepts, techniques, assignments.
[00:17:36] Look at our Six-Minute Networking course, right? It's free. And I'm like, this is drills, exercises, and practices that will help you create and maintain a network, go in and do it. And I'm giving you very specific stuff. And this is a free freaking coach. I would never get coaching for something that is not specific. I have coaches for a lot of things, but it's like, you're going to teach me voiceover for video games. We are going to do demos. We are going to work on scripts, the end. Not like, "I'm going to show you some voiceover stuff. Send me $6,000." It has to be specific.
[00:18:07] Also check out these coach's qualifications. Were they successful in some other field before they began coaching or have they just always been coaching? And their main credential is that they've coach other people. That's a red flag for me. Sure. There are a handful of just top coaches who have been coaches for their entire career. They're amazing. You know, they might've coached the Chicago Blackhawks and now they're a corporate trainer. That's more legit. There's a record there, but those people are right there working in the industry as they now coach, or they've got a degree in psychology or management or some other achievement or accolade. They're trained at reputable institutions. They've consulted for real companies. And you can sort of verify this by getting a letter, not just like, "I spoke at Google once." That doesn't count, okay.
[00:18:51] If this coach, your wife wants to hire, just has an online life coaching cert and 200 hours of, I don't know, like what's a Kadira yoga teacher training or whatever, from Bikram. That's a concern, okay. But if she started in sold a yoga studio and then went on to consult for Reebok and some other major fitness brands and worked at Lululemon Incorporate. Now, that's a different story, very different.
[00:19:15] The other big thing I try to stress out is whether these coaches are encouraging your wife to run with what she's learning on her own, or if they're keeping her on the tap. Okay, we talked about this in that show, Gabriel, that we did about fake gurus and stuff like that, sucking into their funnel. But the fact that she was doing 300 bucks a month and now they're upselling her to the super high ticket 20 grand six-month program. Eh, I don't know, sounds a little suss to me. Any program that says you have to keep coming back or else you won't be successful. That is usually a red flag. Even the freaking military doesn't keep you in bootcamp for more than a few months, right? They get you to graduate you to different stuff, and they don't tell you that you have to do it every single day.
[00:19:58] I'm much more sympathetic to a program that says, "Look, this is 20 grand. We teach you everything. You need to know. You go off and apply it on your own. We want you to do that. We don't want you to have to keep paying us to see results, even though there is ongoing support." Whereas the program that says, "Hey, first you do our weekly coaching. Then you graduate to our six-month program. Then you do our year-long accountability course. And then we're going to spam you with marketing, for retreats and masterminds for the next eight freaking years." Those programs are almost always predatory in some way.
[00:20:30] Gabriel Mizrahi: Yeah, I agree, Jordan. I'm also having a little bit of a reaction to this coach pawning his wife off to another coach she certified. I mean, that doesn't automatically mean that the coach is bad, but I don't know. It just, it sounds like the main life coach she really liked is the face of the brand. And then she sort of farms out clients to different coaches. Maybe so she can scale. It's a little unclear.
[00:20:51] Jordan Harbinger: Yeah, that's a good point. Look, I bumped on that too. Unless these coaches are rigorously trained in the same curriculum. It's really hard to know if she's even getting the quality that she was promised. That's not necessarily a deal breaker, but it's just one more thing on the list of, "Hmm, okay, that's interesting." And I wonder what the payment structure is like, but that's a whole different sort of question.
[00:21:12] Gabriel Mizrahi: Yeah, where's the money — how does the money flow? And also like, as the woman she initially was attracted to, is that the person who's doing the TikTok, like the self-help TikToks, and then it's like, "Oh, I'm interested in your coaching program." She's like, "Great. I have five people who do that for me."
[00:21:24] Jordan Harbinger: Right. "Here's a schmuck, Jordan, who got certified two weeks ago by paying 20 grand and now is working for me," right?
[00:21:30] Gabriel Mizrahi: Yep, exactly, right. So while you do everything, Jordan said, I would also talk to your wife about why she's drawn to this program in the first place. I know she said it's helpful, but why is it helpful? I mean, is it because she likes having someone to talk about her week with, somebody who can keep her accountable, maybe somebody who motivates her. Fair enough. But also is that necessarily something you need to pay somebody for? Or is she finding it helpful? Because this person she's working with is really helping her. They're helping her do some deep work around her habits or her thoughts or her goals, stuff like that. Something that's leading to something measurable. If it's more of the former than I would ask your wife, if she really, really needs to pay somebody 20 grand, to make sure that she's, I don't know, exercising and crossing things off of her to-do list.
[00:22:14] That is the sort of lowest common denominator coaching that in my view, you can probably internalize and do for yourself better. $300 a month to check in once a week. I could see that maybe being reasonable, but $20,000 for the same thing just longer. I don't know. That could easily be a sales funnel upsell with just no real benefit. But if it turns out that your wife really is generating huge returns from this coaching, like she's getting a big promotion. She's demonstrably happier or more focused, then maybe you'll feel more comfortable with her spending the money. But the thing about life coaching is that you usually don't know if you're going to generate those results before you actually begin. That's part of the hustle.
[00:22:54] You know, it'd be interesting, Jordan, if she went to this life coach and said, "Sure, I'll do the program, but here's an idea. I'll pay you half of the money up front. And then I'll give you, let's just say like 20 percent of my additional earnings above what I'm making now for the next two years," which could easily exceed the 20 grand that you would have paid in cash. If this coach really stands behind what she teaches, then, then she'll be more likely to go for that. But if she's like, "Hmm, no, I'll just take the 20 grand. Thanks." You know, that would be pretty telling.
[00:23:21] Jordan Harbinger: Yeah, that's a clever idea. I don't know if a coach would go for that, because then they're dependent on you to execute the results and then actually pay the overage, which, you know, then they're going to chase you for it, potentially. I like where your head's at. It would make an interesting test for sure. Just to even observe how the coach response. Like if she's polite, but firm about her feet. Yeah, fair enough. But if she gets all shifty and defensive, that tells you a lot about her personality or like turns it around and sort of like blames you for even trying to negotiate. "You're negotiating and this is bad. I bet you negotiate with yourself too and compromise your benefit." And you're like, well, you get all spun up and you're like, forget that you're negotiating the price.
[00:23:58] So to answer your question, are all life coaches a scam? No. But in my experience, most of them are just genetic. When I get coaching, I'm getting a skill. I'm getting a real, tangible skill. Voiceover, I'm learning how to do something in production, I'm learning Chinese, right? Some of these coaches are generic, but some are straight up predatory. A life coach can justify charging 20 grand by helping people earn multiples of that. But they kind of have to prove it, right? They have to have past clients that have all used this stuff to really juice up.
[00:24:29] And on that note, you might want to encourage your wife to ask this coach, if she can chat with a couple of her past clients and see what they think. When I was selling programs in coaching, people would say, "Can I speak to past students?" And I was like, "Absolutely. Here's a guy in your area. You might even be able to meet face-to-face. Here's another guy, if you don't click with the first guy or you can't make time to talk." And they were like, "Oh, wow. Okay." You know, these are not easy to find in most — but if they're like, "No, our clients are all confidential," eeh not great, right? That's a Dodge and that's a bad sign.
[00:25:01] So here's my take the question isn't how do I get to a place where I'm okay with something like this. The question is how do I assess this program and understand what my wife really needs right now. If you find out the coach really is a hustler, yeah, put your foot down, but more important. I would help your wife understand why she was drawn to somebody like this in the first place and how she can seek out higher quality influences in the future. And to help you do that, we're going to link to some articles and a deep dive we did on literally this exact topic. It'll be in the show notes, jordanharbinger.com. I highly recommend checking those out and good luck.
[00:25:36] And, you know, Gabe this just occurred to me. I would wonder — and I would ask this, dear, dear writer, is this a program where your wife gets certified to do life coach work? Because they didn't address that in here because he might not know because his wife might actually not have told him. And that's why he needs to look at the curriculum because a lot of these coaches do this sort of shifty crap where they're like, "Sign up for this and get coached. And then sign up for this, and now you're being, it's train the trainer." And you're doing this and it's like the sort of implied promise or maybe even explicit promise is you're going to then be licensed, like the person his wife is working with now to also train other people. And it's a freaking pyramid scheme, essentially. It's a, almost like a Ponzi of self-help. But a lot of times when people join these train the trainer things, they keep it on the low because it's embarrassing. Like she might not say, "I'm a little unhappy in my career. I want to try this life coach thing because I've gotten a lot out of my weekly coaching. It costs 20 grand for me to get certified." Because that's like, "Whoa, you're going to change careers?" But if she's just like, "I like my coaching, let me do the advanced thing." And then she goes through it and later on, she's like, "So I did this and I'm thinking about changing careers because it was amazing. And I'm certified now." Ta-dah. So I would find out if there's something else going on in here, because it is very common for coaches to sell high ticket items and the way they justify a high ticket price, as they say, "You're going to make like five times this in the first year of full-time coaching," which is just nonsense because you need to find clients, which is really, really hard.
[00:27:07] You can reach us email@example.com. Please keep your emails concise. Use a descriptive subject line that makes things easier on us. Include the state and country that you're in, that'll help us give you more detailed advice. If there's something you're going through, any big decision you're wrestling with, or you need a new perspective on stuff like life, love, work. Whether to report your unstable colleague, whatever's got you staying up at night lately, hit us up at fridayatjordanharbinger.com. We're here to help and we keep every single email anonymous.
[00:27:35] All right, next up.
[00:27:36] Gabriel Mizrahi: Hey Jordan and Gabe, I was a teacher for about 15 years until I left the classroom to become an instructional coach, which led to six years in administration. Suffering from compassion, fatigue, and exhaustion, I made the difficult decision to leave my role as principal to return to the classroom all in the middle of a pandemic. Now in my second year as a classroom teacher, I'm struggling to not hate my job and resent my retired from teaching husband. My husband dropped to part-time at the end of his career due to stress, and then fully retired this year. He struggles with stress and anxiety. So he is not really able to support me as a sounding board. Teaching was always my love, but now I've lost my love for the job. And it's super hard to keep up. I hate to blame the kids, but they are definitely different from the ones 15 years ago. Students, parents, the community, the administration, they're far more demanding, far more entitled than ever before. The problem is I'm stuck. As I have three more years before I'm able to retire. I don't know how to survive the next three years. How do I stay in a job that I do not love or even like all that much? Signed, Stuck in Homeroom.
[00:28:43] Jordan Harbinger: Uh, this is rough. I feel for you here. My mom was a public school teacher, a special ed teacher for many years. So I know sort of firsthand/second hand, I guess, how tough this job can be. Gabe, it's so interesting how she thinks the kids and parents are worse now than the ones 15 years ago. I feel like that's probably true. Just based on those like school district meetings or those board meetings, whatever you see on YouTube, where parents are screaming and throwing things at school board members about like masks or curriculum, not including or including evolution, whatever it is like, it's just always nonsense. But maybe it really is true across the board. Teachers have it hard, man. They have to deal with so much crap on top of the super important job of, you know, like actually educating our kids. My hat goes off to all of you.
[00:29:30] Anyway, you're stuck in the classroom. You don't know how you're going to get through the next three years. I assume you have a pension coming after that, which that is probably a good reason to just stick it out at this point. It's kind of what most teachers are working toward. But maybe things are so bad that the money isn't even enough to make you feel like you'll make it. So if you're going to get through the next three years, without slapping a fourth grader, you're going to have to invest in other parts of your life.
[00:29:56] And not that you're not doing this already, but first you really do need to have a rich life outside of the classroom where you can decompress and channel this frustration, the exhaustion in healthier ways. I would find a hobby, tennis, gardening, freaking macrame, whatever that even is. I've heard of it, but I don't really know what it is. It's braiding things I think. And who doesn't love braiding things. Find the piece you're looking for in the classroom, in your own life.
[00:30:22] You know what? This reminds me of, Gabe, remember that federal agent who was like, "I have five more years and my life is meaningless. I just do the same crap every day. Nothing I'm working on is important." And we told them to find meaning outside the federal building, like volunteer a bunch and make your jobs or your secondary thing. This is sort of.
[00:30:39] I would also make a conscious effort to invest in your close relationships. You know, a few good friends, maybe even a fellow teacher, or to your husband who you said you're kind of at wit's end with, but it's not from the sound of it, his fault. We do have to talk about your husband for a moment. You said he's not really able to support you or be a sounding board due to his own stress. I have to think that's what's making this situation. If I were you, I would try opening up to him about what it's like to be going through this without his support, what you could use from him to get through the next few years, but also maybe what you could be doing for him, what he wants from your marriage.
[00:31:18] You know, he's stressed, he's anxious, you're disillusioned and burned out. It sounds like there's a bit of a gulf between you two these days and you guys would both benefit from talking, from listening to each other, coming back together. We could probably talk about your marriage for 45 freaking minutes here, but I'll just leave it there. Invest in your primary support system. That is going to be huge.
[00:31:41] It's also possible that your time in the classroom won't get much better. And let's be honest, you can't fix all of these kids. You can't tell their parents to be kinder. You can't change the environment and the system and the world they're raised in. All you can do and you can control is how you respond to it. How much you let the toxicity affect you, how much responsibility and compassion you realistically can take on. It's possible that you need stronger boundaries to get through the next few years. The most important boundary being, "I will not let this crazy environment drag me down or make me miserable, or keep me up at night stewing in resentment. I'll just be the best teacher I can be. That's all I can do."
[00:32:30] Also keep perspective. I know three years sounds like a long ass time, but it really isn't that long. As miserable as you are now, you will be thrilled when you can retire. And maybe you can start thinking about how you want to spend your retirement and start working towards that now. I bet that'll help you cope with the craziness. If you want to do bike tours, buy the bike, start training now. Grab that Peloton, whatever. If you want to do cooking classes in Palermo, Italy, fire up freaking duo lingo, or email me, I'll refer you to a Italian teacher. Start doing Italian for an hour a day. By the way, I'm not learning Italian. I don't need, I know people that, that sounded confusing. I know language teachers, I got good companies, but I can refer anybody to pretty much any language. If you want a garden, start reading up on different plants and soils or whatever you need to know, just develop that green thumb.
[00:33:18] Whatever it is, I wouldn't wait for your retirement for the fun to begin. Just start planting the seeds, maybe literally, if you go with gardening. I think you'll find the relief you want so badly. It's actually accessible to you in some form right now. You just have to make the effort to seek it out. And I bet it'll be a lot easier to survive a classroom full of screaming, kids and conferences, and d-bag parents if you just know that you're going to go home to a life that you're actually excited about. So start focusing on that. And good luck.
[00:33:52] And also if I were a teacher, I would cut a bitch. So I understand where y'all coming from. Like I have seen and heard so many horror stories from my mom, and this was like the '90s and it's definitely worse now. I understand you. I understand that this is like, people are at their wit's end and don't want to do it and want to get out and can't wait. I feel you. So we're with you. So we're sending you good thoughts and hugs here from California.
[00:34:16] By the way, if you're joining us for the first time, or you want to tell your friends about the show, we've got the episode starter packs. These starter packs, they're collections of your favorite episodes organized by topic. That'll help new listeners get a taste of everything that we do here on the show, go to jordanharbinger.com/start to get started. And we've got Spotify playlist in there as well.
[00:34:36] All right, what's next?
[00:34:37] Gabriel Mizrahi: Hey, Jordan and Gabe, I'm a 21 year old college student and my grandpa passed away last year, which led my dad to inherit around $250,000. His death then caused my dad to slip back into alcoholism, which ultimately led him to pass away earlier this year. It was a surprise and a huge blow as we had gotten quite close since he sobered up a few years ago. Unexpectedly, his passing led me to inherit most of the inheritance that he had just inherited. I've been struggling with guilt about receiving this money as my dad only had it for four months and I haven't really earned any of it. All of this has led my husband and me to have conversations that I never thought would come up so soon. For example, if and how we would help family or friends without enabling them as I have seen it happen quite a bit in my family. Growing up, I always thought that if I were financially stable, I would be quick to assist anybody I could, but now I find myself being stingy with the money, not wanting to touch it until I get older and living a pretty modest lifestyle. I realized the money can be spent very quickly if it's not used correctly. I'm open to investing it or using it to start a side thing like an Airbnb or a rental property. My husband is an accountant and has been very supportive throughout the grief and the probate process, but he's much more open to giving it away and helping people, especially his family. Am I wrong for wanting to use the money to create multiple streams of income so we are able to help people more confidently in the future? Or am I being too protective and stingy with the money? Signed, Worrisome Windfall.
[00:36:04] Jordan Harbinger: Wow. Well, this is a pretty wild turn of events. I'm so sorry that you lost your grandfather and your father, especially your dad due to alcoholism. That is incredibly sad and sudden. You're obviously very fortunate to suddenly have this money. And I think you know that, but some really tragic things happen for it to come your way. And that always, that always sucks. It just does. But here we are, you have an amazing chunk of change to work with. And you're asking a really great question. So let's get into it.
[00:36:30] First of all that guilt that you feel, I totally get it. It's true. You didn't do anything to earn this money in the traditional sense. You might always feel conflicted about that, but the best thing you can do, the only thing you can do really, is accept the absurdity of coming into such a large amount of money and make a promise to yourself that you'll use it responsibly. I think that's how you can sort of earn it, so to speak by becoming a good steward of this gift, which I know you want to.
[00:36:59] Now, I have to say, I think your approach to this money is right. This is what I would probably be doing with it too. Just being conservative. If you put this quarter million into a rental property or an investment portfolio or a college fund or a reliable side business, no life coaching or any sort of smart long-term asset, you'll be setting yourself up nicely. That's good. That's the prudent thing to do. You won't regret being careful with this money now, rather than sinking it into like a crazy kitchen Renault or spending it on clothes and a car and stuff like that. But those are my values. That's what I think is important. Nice things are fun, but they don't mean as much to me as creating meaningful experiences and investing in my future security and stability, okay.
[00:37:45] And look, it is nice to help your friends and family if they need it and if they deserve it, but you're right. When you come into money, a lot of people might start hitting you up and that can easily tip over into enabling, like you've seen happen in your own family. If your uncle wants you to bail him out because he spent all of his money at the freaking dog track, or your cousin who was on her ninth careers, like suddenly, "I want to be a private investigator," like whatever, or she wants to go get a coach to fix her problems. I don't think it's unreasonable to say, "Sorry, I can't subsidize this. I need to take care of my family and pay for education for my kids," or whatever. But if your mother-in-law needs like 10 grand to pay for a knee surgery so she can walk again, that's a very different story, obviously, and that's worth considering. You'll have to make these calls for yourself, which let's just acknowledge. That is definitely a weird position for you to be in. No doubt about it.
[00:38:39] And part of you stepping into this new reality is making peace with the fact that you'll have to make some potentially difficult decisions sometimes. And you might not make everybody happy all the time. But anyway, my point is, I don't think any of this makes you stingy. I don't. I think it makes you responsible. The fact that you didn't go straight to the dealership and snatch up like a Maserati or whatever that says a lot about you. I'm happy to hear that. And you're right. This money can disappear really quickly if you don't use it wisely. Fair or not earned or unearned, this is your money and you get to do what you want.
[00:39:15] So that's my advice. Be smart, be thoughtful, think long-term, and know that it's okay to use this money primarily for you and your family. That's why it was given to you and not to other people. The hardest part will probably be the disagreement with your husband about what to do with the money. You guys will have to have some heart to hearts about what the money means to you, what your goals are as a couple, what your priorities should be. And you need to get on that same page. Since you're married, I assume that the money belongs to both of you legally and practically. So you'll have to sort of, well, you'll have to sort that out.
[00:39:51] And if you guys are totally divided about what to do with it, maybe you compromise, maybe you take, I don't know, a fifth of it and you help his family and the rest you put into an Airbnb property or an IRA. That would be one way to honor both of your needs and take care of your loved ones while also taking care of yourselves. I do want to say congratulations on ending up in this position, but that feels like the wrong word. Like, "Yay, you lost two family members in close succession." Not great. What's the word for congratulations when you didn't do anything to earn something and it comes about through tragedy? I don't know, just enjoy it.
[00:40:26] When you stumble into the situation like this, not so much good luck. The only thing you can really do is make the most of it and be grateful. Your gratitude will make you appreciate the value of what you have, and that'll usually lead you to the right decision and the right choice. Good luck.
[00:40:44] You know, what is a great use of funds inherited or otherwise? Supporting the podcast by supporting the sponsors who make it possible. We'll be right back.
[00:40:53] This is The Jordan Harbinger Show, and this is Feedback Friday. We'll be right back.
[00:40:57] This episode is sponsored in part by Better Help online therapy. We talk about Better Help a lot on this show. This month, we're discussing some of the stigmas around mental health. Do not wait until things are unbearable to go to therapy. I'm guilty of it too, but I've come to learn that therapy is a tool to utilize before things get worse and it can help you avoid those lows. Better Help is customized online therapy that offers video, phone, and even live chat sessions with your therapist. So you don't have to see anyone on camera if you don't want to. It's much more affordable than in-person. And you can be matched with a therapist in under 48 hours. Give it a try and see why over two million people have used Better Help online therapy.
[00:41:35] Jen Harbinger: For 10 percent off your first month visit betterhelp.com/jordan. That's better-H-E-L-P.com/jordan and join over two million people who've taken charge of their mental health with the help of an experienced professional.
[00:41:46] Jordan Harbinger: This episode is also sponsored in part by Fruit of the Loom. It's that time of year to get your loved ones what they really need. It's not a snow globe or a pair of mistletoe. This season, show them you care with underwear from Fruit of the Loom. Take gifts from "oh no" to "how'd you know" with underwear for her, from unbearable holiday ties to the totally wearable cool zone boxer briefs. Give the kids something they'll use every day— we hope — boys and girls' cotton underwear, and instead of another ugly sweater they won't want to put on, give them something they won't want to take off like their ever soft sweatshirt. You see, no matter who you are, underwear is something pretty much everyone needs. So before you settle your loved ones with just another holiday gift, look into your heart and remember their bottoms. Show you care this holiday season by going to fruit.com.
[00:42:27] This episode is also sponsored in part by Glenfiddich. Glenfiddich breaks from the single malt scotch whisky norm, and helps redefine what it means to be rich. It's easy to get bogged down in material success when the currency of the new rich is getting more time and enjoyment out of what you've already got. This is one of the last Feedback Fridays of the year. And, you know, I look at the things that I have and that I've acquired, you know, I got like a new iPhone recently or something, and that's cool. But, you know, what's really cool is being able to help people all the time. I would gladly use a Motorola razor hashtag throwback if I had to, in order to keep helping people on episodes like Feedback Friday. It's really one of the biggest pieces of joy that I take out of my year is looking back at all of these insane problems that we would help people with. This is what I find truly valuable. And I think most of us are like that. We just get kind of distracted by material success in a lot of ways, and it's really unhealthy and it's something that can really start to take control of our lives. And so I'm grateful for you writing in, I'm grateful for hearing your crazy stories and helping you out with your crazy problems, or not so crazy problems. And I'm grateful to Glenfiddich for making episodes like this possible.
[00:43:32] Jen Harbinger: Skillfully crafted, enjoy responsibly. Glenfiddich 2021 imported by William Grant and Sons Inc. New York, New York.
[00:43:39] Jordan Harbinger: And now for the conclusion of Feedback Friday.
[00:43:44] All right. Next up.
[00:43:45] Gabriel Mizrahi: Hey guys, I'm the office manager and big picture person at a very busy therapy practice. My boss is a hugely talented and insightful psychologist who's well-respected in our area, not only for her elucidating assessments, but also for the time she gives families and their support teams, so they understand the diagnoses that she's giving. In her pricing, we build in a 30-minute post-assessment consult. However, the amount of time she spends working with families far exceeds that sometimes upwards of 15 to 20 hours more all for free. Some families just ask and ask and she keeps on giving her product, being her expertise. She's an angel, but it never leads to more referrals and it doesn't make her happy or build her brand in the way that she wants. I'd like to help her examine this tendency and establish clear boundaries as she expresses distress at the amount of time she's giving away. What's your take on this as master relationship builders? When does consulting turn into giving away the milk for free? Signed, Finding the ROI when the Well's Running Dry.
[00:44:45] Jordan Harbinger: This is a great question. As you know, I talk all the time about investing in other people, not having an immediate expectation of return, not being attached to a return because that really is the best way to build meaningful relationships. It's also in my experience, anyway, one of the best ways to be happy. Whether it's at work or in your personal life, being generous as a matter of policy, it just makes life more interesting and more fulfilling. So I guess in that way, it's also kind of selfish, but there's a caveat to that principle and the caveat is to be generous up until the point where it's compromising your own security or your own hapiness. If helping other people is putting you out, putting you at serious risk, and by that, I mean, it's causing you to neglect your own needs, or you lose a bunch of money or a bunch of sleep, or you sacrifice your health, then it's time to reassess how much you're giving away to other people. You still have to take care of yourself. You can't abandon yourself in the process of serving other people.
[00:45:45] Now, it's not clear whether your boss is actually suffering because of all this free work she's giving away. But you did say it doesn't make her happy. She's distressed. So that might be a sign it's time to recalibrate. The other caveat to being super generous is that you still have to be generous with the right people in the right ways. So if you're giving away a ton of time and expertise to people who just don't even appreciate it, or they don't even use it, there's nothing meaningful done with it. They don't reciprocate in some form over the long-term ever, then it's possible you're investing in the wrong people.
[00:46:17] That's more of a global thought for everyone listening right now. Not so much only for your boss. She's a doctor. These are her patients. The terms of that relationship are very specific, but yes, you're absolutely right. Your boss does need to look at this tendency. If she is giving away 15 to 20 hours of consultation to each family for free, that does seem excessive. You said she's an angel, which is a great quality given that she's there to take care of people. But I do wonder if being an angel is another way of saying a real people pleaser who doesn't have boundaries. Maybe she's afraid of letting people down by saying, "I'm sorry, but I offer 30 minutes of consultation. And after that, you'll have to book another appointment."
[00:47:00] And I might be reaching here, but you'll have to decide if there's some truth to that. Is it possible that she's giving away her time and expertise as a way to feel needed or valued, or to be seen a certain way by her patients? And if any of that is true, it would be great. If you could ask her why she feels compelled to give away so much time to her patients, what's making it so hard for her to put her foot? Why does she feel drawn to being so involved with her patients' families? She's the psychologist. She's trained to understand the importance of boundaries. How they allow for the right kind of care? How they help protect the clinician? So she should be willing to look at this. And if you can help her see that giving away so much free work, isn't just making her unhappy, but it's also not serving her practice. Since it's not leading to more referrals or building her brand, you might get her to see this in a totally new way.
[00:47:55] Gabriel Mizrahi: Which would be such a great gift for her as a clinician, because I'm getting the sense that she's so wrapped up in this way of doing business, that she can't even see this clearly. But if she's determined to keep giving away this much free consultation to be people. Then I wonder if there might be ways to make that investment more valuable for you guys. So for example, what if you helped your boss turn these consultations that she's doing into case studies, and then you could post those case studies on the website. So new patients who are considering her practice can see the kind of work she does, how she approaches her patients, how involved she is with their patients, what kind of results she gets. That would be a nice way to pay this off.
[00:48:28] Or here's another idea if your boss wants to publish some articles in psychology magazines or journals, or maybe she wants to write a book one day, maybe she could draw on some of these consultations for material, for the book or for the article. Or she could follow up with the families she consults with after a month, after two months, maybe six months out, ask them how they're doing, if they need anything and maybe just throw in there, "Hey, would you mind leaving me a review online? That would be a huge benefit to the business."
[00:48:54] Point is whatever you decide to do, I would think about how to translate this woman's incredible into something more tangible for the business. I think that's completely fair. Her patients probably aren't going to do that on their own and look to be fair, it's probably not on them to find ways to pay her back because as Jordan pointed out, they are her patients. So the relationship has pretty fixed terms, but it is on you as the big picture person, the strategy person here to get creative. So I would work with your boss to figure out what aspects of her brand she actually does want to build, how she could actually get more referrals out of this work, and then work backward to connect the dots between the free work that she's doing and the benefits she wants to see.
[00:49:32] All of that said, though, your boss definitely needs to look at those boundaries. There's obviously nothing wrong with being a compassionate, generous doctor. I wish there were more of them out there, but if she's giving away dozens and dozens of hours and not getting anything in return and she's miserable. Then, yeah, I do think that's a sign that something needs to change. And the way that you could approach that conversation with her is, you know, you could say something like, "I see you giving away so much of your time. I know how much you care about your patients. I get that this is coming from a really good place, but I also know that you're not happy. You're not happy as a person. You're not satisfied as a clinician. So let's figure this out. I have some ideas about how we can make this more sustainable for you, how we can generate some more value for the practice, but we should also talk about how much time you can really afford to give away." And then you can be her partner and you can be her friend and you can help her look at some of this stuff more closely.
[00:50:21] Jordan Harbinger: Yeah. Great point, Gabe. I think the answer is a combination of both. Setting stronger boundaries, but also maximizing the value of her generosity, which is what all great relationship builders do. No matter what industry they're in, they're deliberate, even while they're being thought. If you can help your boss get there, I think you guys will find a way to be generous without giving the milk away for free to the point of exhaustion. Good luck.
[00:50:47] This documentary of the week is brought to you as well by Fruit of the Loom. Instead of another ugly sweater, show them you care with underwear from Fruit of the Loom. Now, this documentary Behind the Curve on Netflix is, it's funny/tragic and sad, right? It's about flat earthers and it sort of lets them, it gives them enough rope to hang themselves with. Now, I know that some of you believe the earth is flat because I hear from you in my inbox. You're not going to like this documentary. But the people who believe that the earth is round, and I think that's probably the majority of you, are going to enjoy this documentary. We'll link it in the show notes. It's called Behind the Curve. It shows the culture of flat earth, why people are interested in it. And it really shows that even their own experiments, trying to prove the earth is flat, for some reason, they keep proving the earth is round. Go figure.
[00:51:30] Thanks to Fruit of the Loom for sponsoring the documentary of the week.
[00:51:34] I hope y'all enjoyed that. I want to thank everyone who wrote in this week and everyone who listened. Go back and check out Spencer Roberts and Metta World Peace if you haven't yet.
[00:51:42] By the way, I know we just did a relationship building thing and I would be remiss if I didn't plug our free course, Six-Minute Networking. Systems, software, tiny habits, all the stuff I use to create and maintain relationships. It's a free course. There's no BS upsells. Not yet anyway. It's at jordanharbinger.com/course, right there on the Thinkific platform.
[00:52:01] A link to the show notes for this episode can be found at jordanharbinger.com. Transcripts are in the show notes as well. I'm at @JordanHarbinger on Twitter and Instagram, and you can also hit me on LinkedIn. You can find Gabe on Twitter at @GabeMizrahi or on Instagram at @GabrielMizrahi.
[00:52:16] This show is created in association with PodcastOne. My team is Jen Harbinger, Jase Sanderson, Robert Fogarty, Ian Baird, Millie Ocampo, Josh Ballard, and of course, Gabriel Mizrahi. Our advice and opinions are our own. I'm a lawyer, but I am a terrible lawyer. And I'm also not your lawyer. So do your own research before implementing anything you hear on the show. Remember, we rise by lifting others. Share the show with those you love. If you found this episode useful, please share it with somebody else who can use the advice that we gave here today. In the meantime, do your best to apply what you hear on the show, so you can live what you listen, and we'll see you next time.
[00:52:50] If you're looking for another episode of The Jordan Harbinger Show to sink your teeth into, I wanted to give you a preview of one of my favorite stories from an earlier episode of the show, Megan Phelps-Roper. She used to belong to one of the most hateful religious cults in America, the Westboro Baptist Church. She was born into this church and she later escape, to hear her tell the story firsthand, it's really incredible.
[00:53:13] Megan Phelps-Roper: I started protesting when I was five years old, but even at that first picket, there was a sign that said, "Gays are worthy of death." So God hates fags is what Westboro's message that we became known for. We were the good guys and everyone outside the church was evil and going to hell. And we had the only message that would bring the world any hope. We had to go and warn people, these terrible things are happening. And if you want this pain to stop, then you have to change because God isn't going to change.
[00:53:41] After the September 11 attacks, we had the sign that said, "Thank God for September 11." What were we thinking? This massive crowd comes down. We were at this corner of this intersection of these three streets. By the time they actually reached us, we're just enraged. There was no space between us and them. And it got really dicey. One of my cousins gave his signs to somebody else and like started standing on top of a trash can pretending like he wasn't with us. They were again, incredibly intense because obviously the circumstances are so sobering. It brings me incredible sadness to think about now.
[00:54:16] I can do this forever. My family, they would refuse to have any contact with me at all, once I left. Somebody that we had confided in send a letter to my parents and told them that we were planning to leave. And then that email came in and we left.
[00:54:34] Jordan Harbinger: For more with Megan, including the details of her harrowing experience and escape, check out episode 302 of The Jordan Harbinger Show.
[00:54:44] This episode is also sponsored in part by LifeLock. The holiday season of giving is also a holiday season of taking for cybercriminals, looking to cash in. Some tips to help you stay safe while holiday shopping include only visiting secure sites and apps from retailers that you trust, not those shady ones you see advertised online. Use a VPN instead of public Wi-Fi, create strong passwords. Don't reuse the same freaking one for every site. Check your bank and credit records for fraud. Every day, we put our information at risk on the Internet. And in an instant, a cybercriminal could steal what's yours, sometimes even harm your finances, your credit and your reputation. Good thing, there's LifeLock. LifeLock helps detect a wide range of identity threats, like your social security number for sale on the dark web. If they detect your information has been potentially compromised, they'll send you an alert. You have access to a dedicated restoration specialist if you become a victim.
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