1190: Kid’s Out of the Fray, But Hates Your Fiancée | Feedback Friday

1190: Kid's Out of the Fray, But Hates Your Fiancée | Feedback Friday

This transcript is yet untouched by human hands. Please proceed with caution as we sort through what the robots have given us. We appreciate your patience!

Jordan Harbinger: [00:00:00] Welcome to Feedback Friday. I'm your host, Jordan Harbinger. As always, I'm here with Feedback Friday producer, the purse stool propping up your designer baggage and this brassy of life drama. Gabriel Mizrahi

Gabriel Mizrahi: purse stool. What is a purse stool?

Jordan Harbinger: Oh, do I get to teach you something this week? Yes. Okay. Please do you, you know when you go to a restaurant with your girlfriend?

Uh oh, a girlfriend by the way. That's something you get when you are not gallivanting around the world and pulling all-nighters to have work calls with me from Portugal. Oh yeah, I've heard about these. I gotta say a girlfriend is a great way to learn a language. It is, yeah. We used to call them long-haired dictionaries and it really does speed up the process if you know, you know, there's nothing like walking around on a day off and being like, I'm too lazy to study.

And then you're just like, what is this? And she's like, flower

Gabriel Mizrahi: rock. Mm-hmm. Door stool, purse stool. Depends which lexicon you wanna learn. But what, what is a purse stool?

Jordan Harbinger: It's basically a little chair or stool for a woman's handbag. So it doesn't sit on the [00:01:00] floor. Think like tiny ottoman. You know, you go to a cafe and you got this nice bag.

What? You're gonna put that on the ground?

Gabriel Mizrahi: Okay. So instead of putting it on the back of your chair, there's actually a piece of furniture.

Jordan Harbinger: Okay? It's so you can keep your eye on it. In the back of your chair, I got, it's the less safe outdoor cafe, you know,

Gabriel Mizrahi: et cetera, et cetera. Now you're over explaining. I got it.

I hope I need a purse stool one day. That's all I can say.

Jordan Harbinger: You could buy a purse. It would probably go well with one of your blouses. I already have half the wardrobe. I might as well get the stool. That's right. You might as well accessorize on the Jordan Harbinger Show. We decode the stories, secrets, and skills of the world's most fascinating people, and turn there, wisdom them into practical advice that you can use to impact your own life and those around you.

Our mission is to help you become a better informed, more critical thinker. During the week, we have long form interviews with a variety of amazing folks, former jihadi, drug traffickers, astronauts, national security advisors, hostage negotiators. This week we had Eddie Fishman, author of Chokepoints. Sadly, a book that is not about anything to do with BDSM.

It's about American power in the, in the age of economic warfare, [00:02:00] showed a little too much skin there. Eddie's a former top State Department sanctions official. Super interesting guy. He basically takes you into you. Okay. Kind just

Gabriel Mizrahi: the minute you said that. I pictured you in a gimp suit after last week and I just can't erase the image for my mind.

I'm losing it with the zipper mouth. Undo. I do the show

Jordan Harbinger: intro.

Gabriel Mizrahi: Sorry. But you're just like going on about economic warfare and I'm just picturing you at like the Kit cat club in Berlin. Yes. Go on.

Jordan Harbinger: Which I probably couldn't get into. He basically, Eddie Fishman that is, takes you into the back rooms of power to reveal the untold history of the last two decades of US foreign policy.

Renouncing globalization, waging economic war building a whole suite of economic weapons. Basically how America uses slash exploits its dominance in global finance and technology to address national security threats for better or for worse, really interesting conversation about things like sanctions and US dollar hegemony and stuff.

We don't get too in the weeds, but it's very, very interesting how this stuff came about and how we use it. [00:03:00] On Fridays though, we share stories, take listener letters, offer advice, play increasingly bizarre sound bites, and tease Gabe for not knowing about niche, but let's be honest, not that niche furniture categories apparently.

Gabriel Mizrahi: So, hey, before we dive in, a few weeks ago, I made a joke in one of the sign-offs about Canada being our 51st state. I believe this was in the letter from the woman whose boyfriend's parents reacted poorly when they told him that they were gonna move to Texas for grad school. And in the sign off, I made this innocent joke, or what I thought was an innocent joke about Trump's whole 51st State annexation thing.

And a couple of our Canadian listeners wrote in pretty upset about it. I

Jordan Harbinger: mean, I guess I could have seen that coming. Didn't I actually call you out for alienating our wonderful Canadian listeners when you said that

Gabriel Mizrahi: you did? Yeah. And I think I said something like what? Like that's controversial. Mm-hmm.

So apparently my American sarcasm did not translate north of the 49th parallel because obviously I know that it does not sit well with you guys. And I'm sorry that you thought that I was being sincere and having a laugh about you guys being low key, potentially [00:04:00] annexed. You have to understand something down here or in the States rather.

I'm in, I'm in Portugal now. That is so weird.

Jordan Harbinger: Yeah.

Gabriel Mizrahi: But in the States, at least with reasonable people, the people I know, Trump's 51st State talk just strikes us as absurd. I feel like every week he says some insane shit that nobody really takes seriously.

Jordan Harbinger: Yeah. There's like a handful of people that will take it seriously and then a bunch of people that will contort themselves to try and make it make sense.

But it's just Trump popping off. He knows how to take advantage of the news cycle. Yeah. He knows how to maintain attention. I just assume that's what he's doing most of the time.

Gabriel Mizrahi: Nobody normal in the states, as far as I know, really, truly believes that he's going to annex Canada. Although I know that the tariff negotiations have been very stressful, very tense, and I understand that that is very real.

So when I made that joke, I truly meant no harm. And I know that that kind of thing lands differently for you guys than it does for us. And that's why I said that thing about like, eh, what is that? Controversial, but. I gotta say, I did not know how hard Canadians were taking it until you guys wrote me. And I also did not realize that there's this boycott of [00:05:00] tourism to America right now and that it's so big.

So I appreciate you filling me in, and I'm more than happy to understand this better. And if the positions were reversed, I probably wouldn't find it that funny either. And actually. In a weird way, it does kind of help me empathize with those parents from the letter a little bit more because if I remember correctly, part of the reason that they didn't approve of the move is that they hate America right now for this stuff.

So they didn't wanna like send their son off to a country that's talking like this.

Jordan Harbinger: That makes sense. It's funny. I'm going to vacation in Canada next week. Are you? Where are you going? I wanna, Vancouver, I'm gonna visit some friends. Gonna Victoria. Oh, nice. It's a small area.

Gabriel Mizrahi: I like Vancouver a lot. And I'm not just saying that 'cause I'm apologizing.

Jordan Harbinger: Yeah, no, you have to, you, you have to lay it on thick. I get to go there with no agenda other than seeing my friends. I don't have to apologize to anybody right now, Gabe. It's kind of a nice change of pace. Uh, yeah, I, no, I love Canada. I grew up in Michigan. We basically, I always make this joke, we're basically Canadians with shitty healthcare coming from Michigan.

We're north of parts of Canada in Detroit. So Yeah,

Gabriel Mizrahi: good point. Michigan is basically Canada's 11th province. Right.

Jordan Harbinger: So queue up those [00:06:00] angry emails. But yeah, good point. If we'd understood that better, maybe we could have pitched an even better script for how that listener could talk to the parents, help them separate this administration from the country itself and from the people.

And I will note last time the United States went toe to toe with Canada, we lost and the White House was literally on fire from what I understand. So

Gabriel Mizrahi: there is that, that would've been helpful. So actually I'm kind of happy to take my Canadian lumps on this one because it is opening up my worldview and I'm, you know, it's helping me understand how you guys feel, which I always appreciate.

But anyway, look, you can rest assured that we don't actually feel this way. It was just a dumb joke. And it was really a reference actually to the fears, the perhaps not entirely founded, but now more understandable fears of those parents from the letter. And I just wanna say that at the top.

Jordan Harbinger: Thanks for that, Gabe.

Although I still think those parents were being largely selfish and highly enmeshed by not letting their son go off and live his life. They anti-US stuff, to me seemed more like a pretext for controlling their kid. I don't know.

Gabriel Mizrahi: I completely agree. I have the same feeling.

Jordan Harbinger: Well, while you were working hard to win our Canadian brothers and sisters back over, I remembered a funny story [00:07:00] from years ago that I had forgotten about.

So this is not related to Canada. I'm gonna give you a break here. I was living in New York City. Down on Wall Street and there's an Hermes store connected to the building that I lived in, wall and Broad. And it's a super nice sort of flagship store. And they would throw out really nice stuff sometimes in the alley because, you know, displays and whatever, or at least so we thought, so one day we're decorating our apartment.

We kind of just moved in a few weeks ago and there's a bunch of guys living in a one bedroom apartment and we needed walls and stuff, so we put up pressure walls and we needed office area. 'cause we had this big open communal space. So we got onto the alley and we see this awesome hand cut wooden display with decals on it.

It's super, super nice. And we're like, I cannot believe her Mez is throwing this away. This is incredible. So we grab it and we bring it upstairs and we were just like, yeah. I mean, I guess they just get rid of their old displays. Why not? Why wouldn't they? And it was massive and it was really tall. It just looked [00:08:00] great.

We couldn't believe our luck and we kept that in the apartment for a really, really long time. And then, I don't know, eight months or even a year in eight months, God knows, into our lease, one of the guys is like, Hey, I met this girl that works at Hermes downstairs. And we're like, oh, interesting. He brought her up to talk and hang out in our apartment and she goes, Hey, where did you guys get these walls?

And we were like, oh, you're not gonna believe it. In fact, we could use your help here. You guys threw this out and we grabbed it. So anytime you wanna throw out a display, call us. 'cause we really put these things to use. We'll take another one. Yeah. And she goes, uh, yeah, we didn't throw that away. That was outside for like five minutes.

Oh no. And it was being installed and it was like a custom hand cut, very important seasonal display and somebody stole it. Oh no. And we couldn't believe it. And we looked on the cameras and we couldn't find who took it or anything. 'cause the cameras like weren't functioning in the alley. Blah, blah, blah.

And they filed a police report and we were like, oh my God, we [00:09:00] stole her me's seasonal display. That is so funny. Yeah. And now

Gabriel Mizrahi: she's dating

Jordan Harbinger: one of the thieves. Correct. Yeah, because we all just went down there and like grabbed it and brought it upstairs in, in the elevator and the doormen were like, whoa, that's cool.

Where'd you get that? We like at the alley. It's her, me threw it out.

Gabriel Mizrahi: Totally. Uh, totally unrelated question. Did it have any, uh, vermilion blouses in it, or is there No, there was no clothing. There was nothing

Jordan Harbinger: to wear associated with it. It was just this like really nice thick, hinged wooden, I believe the old term that you don't use anymore are Chinese walls.

You know those like bendy room dividers? Okay. Never heard that it was like that, but huge. And decaled and cut by hand clearly. It was really funny. Apparently it caused this major shit storm at Hermes and they had to call the central office and be like, so our display got stolen. They're like, someone broke in and they're like, mm.

It was kind of in the alley. And they're like, what? Oh no. Probably somebody was like looking for the key to the front window, went inside, left this thing there, it came out and it was gone.

Gabriel Mizrahi: And you guys just made quick work out of it. Yeah. That's so funny. You probably set them back like $28,000 and you just got a new [00:10:00] wall.

Oh, who knows? They

Jordan Harbinger: probably had to wait an extra week to get a new display to run their seasonal event or whatever. Mm-hmm. It was a huge mess. Wow. She was like, yeah, that's all my manager and I talked about for a week is where this thing went and who would've taken

Gabriel Mizrahi: it. So did she tell her bosses she found it or

Jordan Harbinger: absolutely not?

No. We were like, we were like, you cannot tell anyone because they're never gonna believe that. We just thought we found it. Wow. Like we're gonna end up getting sued by Hermes. No, thank you. Alright, as usual, we've got some fun ones and some doozies. Gabe, what is the first thing out of the mail back?

Gabriel Mizrahi: Just a heads up that this first letter deals with some heavy stuff, um, sexual abuse, mostly in case you're listening with kids in the car or whatever.

Just keep that in mind. Hello Dynamic duo. Ah, I like it. In 2016, I had my first child, a beautiful girl named Lydia, whose name is apparently being stigmatized on your show now.

Jordan Harbinger: Oh yeah. That took a bit of a turn there. That bit just took on a life of its own. Sometimes the names choose us guys. We don't actually have anything real against people named Lydia.

Gabriel Mizrahi: I remember for a while, listeners named [00:11:00] Jessica were writing in being like, Jordan, can you please pick a different name when you go for the generic annoying girl character in a story we

Jordan Harbinger: did? Yeah. First it was Karen's who definitely have it the worst out of anyone. Then it was Jessica's. Yeah. Then we caught some flack for Angela.

Gabriel Mizrahi: Oh, you love Angela.

Jordan Harbinger: I don't know why, but whenever I imagine a character in a feedback Friday letter who's like the friend at work or the roommate. My mind is always Angela.

Gabriel Mizrahi: Angela. Every time

Jordan Harbinger: and now apparently I've insulted our friend. Here's daughter. There's no safe name. That's the problem. No,

Gabriel Mizrahi: and she's the most innocent of all the Lydias for sure.

So I feel bad.

Jordan Harbinger: Yeah, it's look, it's how the bit works. There's no way I can pick a name that no one has, but it won't sound believable.

Gabriel Mizrahi: Sorry. Goes on. I didn't think I was ready for fatherhood, but having a family was what I wanted for so long. I had only been dating her mother for a few months when we found out she was pregnant, we fought all the time and I wasn't happy, but I was determined to make it work.

The last thing I wanted was a broken family. Yeah, tough situation. She became the type of person who had to fight you on absolutely everything. I had a physically demanding job for meager pay, [00:12:00] and she would constantly pick fights when I got home. I've had clinical depression since I was about 15, but I would say that this was my first real low point.

I would walk into any room and make a game out of seeing how many ways I could end my life.

Jordan Harbinger: Wow. Okay, so this got really bad. I'm really sorry to hear that, man. Geez.

Gabriel Mizrahi: Then one day I decided it was time to play the game. After my first failed suicide attempt, I decided I needed to do a voluntary stay at a psych ward.

Jordan Harbinger: Wow. Okay. I am very glad you listened to that voice. Yes. I'm sure it wasn't easy, but yeah. If you're having thoughts like that, you gotta ask for help. You gotta do it.

Gabriel Mizrahi: Two weeks later, I was back home and it was like nothing had changed. The fighting continued with a $2,000 medical bill to boot. Ugh. A week after my daughter's first birthday, her mom and I finally arrived at something we agreed on.

It was time to leave. My daughter was young enough that she wouldn't remember any of it, so we decided it was better to split now rather than raise a child in a home with parents who practically hated each other.

Jordan Harbinger: Yeah, [00:13:00] I think that was probably for the best. All things considered.

Gabriel Mizrahi: We settled on her being the custodial parent throughout the week, and I would get her from Friday morning to Sunday afternoon.

I've always been a third shift worker, so switching my sleep schedule every weekend wasn't fun, but I made it work. When we broke up, we made a deal that whenever we dated other people, we had to be with them for at least six months before they could meet our daughter. They had to meet the other parent first.

A rule that I followed religiously and by her family's account, she did not. She began dating some real winners. She went from one guy who had a warrant out for his arrest in Nevada and had eight children by seven different women. Oh my God. My ex would later become number eight to a guy who was just on parole for his third felony drug charge and second domestic violence charge.

Jordan Harbinger: What a track record. Man, that must have been stressful watching that happen in slow motion.

Gabriel Mizrahi: When I met Mr. Wifebeater, I decided to give him the benefit of the doubt. Maybe some people can change a decision. I deeply regret my [00:14:00] wife moved out of her dad's trailer to a bedbug infested motel in a town well known as a drug haven.

The only reason I even knew where they were was that I found her court records when she got arrested for child endangerment of the kid she had with the guy from Nevada. That summer we took a family vacation to Florida. It was during that trip that my daughter told me about her mom's boyfriend, quote, touching her, jj,

Jordan Harbinger: oh, this is awful.

One of the worst things you can imagine hearing from your child. I am so sorry, Gabe. I'm obviously thinking about the dad from last week whose daughter was also abused by her mom's partner. How do people let this

Gabriel Mizrahi: happen? Dude, so sad. It is crazy how often this happens.

Jordan Harbinger: It's way more than people realize.

It is so upsetting. Yeah, it's really hard to know how much the other parent knows in a situation like this, but it really does make my blood boil. When people bring questionable or just unknown people or, or complete pieces of crap around their kids. What the

Gabriel Mizrahi: hell? Seriously not. Okay. No. So he goes on, my stomach dropped and I felt my face go numb.[00:15:00]

I asked her what she meant and she went into great detail down to the clothes she was wearing. She was asleep and her mom and brother were in the bath. He touched her and as she stated, put his thing against her butt. She was four, and this sick violated her.

Jordan Harbinger: First of all, I'm so angry with her mom, her shitty mom, for bringing this creep around.

I, I don't have any words for this. I'm, yeah,

Gabriel Mizrahi: livid. Understandably livid. I know. I get it. When we got home, I was forced to return her to her mother because of the shared custody agreement. Hell no. As soon as I got to my home, I called CPS. I got immediate temporary custody pending the investigation.

Jordan Harbinger: Excellent. You cannot waste any time with this stuff. Well done. I don't even know if I would've returned her home. I would've just driven to the damn police station. But you did the right thing, man.

Gabriel Mizrahi: In the end, however, the police and the DA refuse to press charges due to lack of physical evidence.

Jordan Harbinger: I mean, I, it's so frustrating, but unfortunately that's very common and I understand.

I mean, they can only do so much.

Gabriel Mizrahi: I filed for full custody. I won almost immediately, [00:16:00] and she didn't even show up for the last hearing. She now gets one hour of supervised visitation a week

Jordan Harbinger: mother of the year, so she knew she screwed up or just didn't even care enough to fight this unfreaking believable,

Gabriel Mizrahi: or she's maybe on drugs and is just completely out of it

Jordan Harbinger: has to be just a complete loser, druggie, gross.

Gabriel Mizrahi: Fast forward to today. I'm now happily engaged to my new partner and we have a second daughter together. The trouble is that my fiance doesn't get along with my first daughter. My daughter is very rude, defiant, and disrespectful, but only to my fiance. My fiance says that there's this wall with her and she doesn't know why she's in therapy and trying to fix it, but it's gotten to the point that I'm second guessing the marriage, which kills me because this is the only time I've ever been truly happy with a partner.

I don't want to throw away the person I love, but I also don't want to go back to the broken home dynamic. We've made some progress, but there's so much to be done. For the past few years, I've been trying to get my [00:17:00] daughter into therapy to work through the trauma, but in our area, pediatric psychiatry is impossible to find.

She's eight now, but her attention and cognitive abilities aren't really where they should be at her age, and every therapist we find says she needs someone who specializes in play therapy. We finally found the only one within a reasonable distance, and there's a two year wait list. I've tried looking into telehealth and not a single one does pediatric.

What can I do if I can't find a therapist soon? How do I keep my family from falling apart? And how do I grapple with the feeling of being a terrible father for not doing more to protect her from a monster? Signed a father contending with mending something heartrending without upending this pending family blending.

Jordan Harbinger: Dude, this story is extremely sad. Yeah, there's so much going on here. Well, as you can tell, I'm heartbroken and I am furious that your daughter was abused by her mom's POS boyfriend. It is an awful thing to have happen, and as a father, my heart [00:18:00] really goes out to you learning about something like this.

It's just gotta be incredibly disturbing, and that's a massive understatement. There are no words, but I gotta say, it sounds like you are doing so much right here. You called CPS, you got custody, you've protected and stabilized your daughter. That is all fantastic. That is exactly what we would've told you to do.

I am so relieved that your daughter has one solid parent. She needs you. You're showing up really well for. Look, if you can't find a therapist for your daughter, although I definitely keep looking, calling around, asking for advice from everyone you talk to, but if there's really no one available right now, I'd look into other ways of meeting your daughter's needs and supporting her.

The best thing you can do is keep investing in your relationship with her. That means spending dedicated time with her, making her feel loved, supported, understood, inviting her to open up as much as she can at her age. I mean, she's eight. Making it safe for her to talk to you about what she's going through, what she's feeling.

It sounds like you guys are already pretty connected, but maybe you start a little ritual to carve out time for the two of you. Could be a weekly walk together, [00:19:00] a bedtime story routine, a sing along in the car, on the way home from school, whatever it is. These small moments of connection, they often do more for healing and detachment than an hour in a therapist's office once a week.

Another thing you can do, contact your daughter's school and ask if they have a school counselor or a social worker trained in trauma or behavioral interventions. They probably can't provide full therapy, but they might be able to check in on your daughter regularly, see if she needs anything. They might even be able to help you advocate for services for her in your area, especially if they determine that she needs extra support given her cognitive abilities.

Now, I would also check out some trauma-informed parenting programs. One of the most popular is called trust-Based Relational Intervention at TBRI. There's an online TBRI course for parents. The creators of TBRI also wrote a book called The Connected Child. I would grab a copy of that, see if you can apply some of the tools to your daughter.

We'll link to those in the show notes. Of course, there's also Circle of Security Parenting, the Incredible Years Parenting With Love and Limits, just to name a few. Some of these programs, they might run you a few hundred [00:20:00] bucks. A couple might be more than that, but pro tip, check with local mental health clinics in your area.

Early childhood centers, parenting support, nonprofits, they often offer these courses for free or they're subsidized, and if they don't, honestly man, if they don't, please write us. We'll fund it for you. Parenting a child with these challenges is too important of a job. I wanna make sure you have all the resources that you need.

Gabriel Mizrahi: There's also a nonprofit called the National Child Traumatic Stress Network, and they offer tons of resources for parents that also integrate trauma-informed principles. So again, we're gonna link to all of these things in the show notes for you.

Jordan Harbinger: Also, activities like art, music, drama, therapies, sports, all of these can offer a child alternative forms of expression and healing.

Keep them invested in their minds and in their bodies. So I'd find some fun hobbies and communities for your daughter. Also, I would consider consulting a therapist on your own and maybe going with your fiance too, maybe even seeing her therapist, if you guys are comfortable with that, and just get some guidance on how to best respond to your daughter's behaviors.

This can be part coaching, part space for you and your partner to [00:21:00] talk out and work through the challenges that you're facing.

Gabriel Mizrahi: I was gonna say, this feels like a really good moment for them to be in couples therapy. Yes. Because this challenge with his daughter is bringing up some really interesting, big questions, not just how to respond to a child with trauma, with unique needs, but you know also how they relate to each other and how her relationship with a daughter is impacting them, and whether this relationship is actually the right one.

Can it survive? We can't tell you for sure whether you should stay with your fiance, but I can say that A, it sounds like you guys have a really special connection, and B, these challenges with your daughter are not necessarily insurmountable, especially since you really love this woman. You say, this is the only time you've ever been truly happy with a partner.

So it sounds to me like she's really trying to connect with your daughter. She's even going to therapy to work specifically on this, and it's your daughter who's struggling with this. You know, your partner sounds pretty thoughtful. She sounds like a great future stepmom. So I do think it would be a shame to break up just because things are bumpy right now.

Jordan Harbinger: Yeah. I really gotta think that his daughter would've a problem with any [00:22:00] other woman in the picture. I don't think it's specifically his fiance now,

Gabriel Mizrahi: you know? Right. So if he breaks up with this woman for his daughter, this could easily happen with the next person. Right.

Jordan Harbinger: Exactly. What's he supposed to do?

Stay single forever because his daughter has this trauma. That's not fair, workable to him at all. And it might be depriving everyone here of the opportunity to actually work through the friction.

Gabriel Mizrahi: I'm with you a hundred percent. The more interesting theme here might be his profound fear of this broken home dynamic.

Let's remember that that's what caused him to stay with the mother of his first child.

Jordan Harbinger: Right?

Gabriel Mizrahi: Which he might have had some good reasons to do. You know, I understand that they got pregnant very quickly, but that might have also made him stick around or try to stick around in a bad situation that was not fixable.

Jordan Harbinger: And now it's coming up again. Except this time. It sounds like his partner's actually a keeper.

Gabriel Mizrahi: Yeah. I'm just noticing that this is a thing for him. You know, I appreciate that he's being thoughtful about creating stability for his children as he should, and there's no reason to break up just because they're struggling right now, but his own past, his own fears.

The idea that breaking up with somebody might be the solution when the [00:23:00] work that they still have to do seems overwhelming. All of that is clearly playing a very big role here.

Jordan Harbinger: I find it interesting that he's asking, how do I keep my family from falling apart? But then I also hear him saying, I'm second guessing the marriage because my daughter doesn't get along with my partner and there's so much work to be done.

Gabriel Mizrahi: Yes,

Jordan Harbinger: I get it. It probably is distressing and exhausting and maybe seems unfixable. To your point, Gabe, I wonder if his go-to solution might be to call it quits because doing all this work with and for his daughter, and it is a lot of work, I'm not discounting that, but is he fantasizing about breaking up because the process they're in is just too daunting?

Because right now it feels like intolerable somehow.

Gabriel Mizrahi: Right? But then by doing that, he would inadvertently be creating the very thing that he says he fears the most, which is interesting.

Jordan Harbinger: So is there also a theme here of turning away from the discomfort of his daughter's healing? Is it hard for him to hang in the conflict between his daughter and his wife and trust that this might be a necessary phase of their relationship and also of his daughter's growth?

Gabriel Mizrahi: Those are really good questions. That is exactly

Jordan Harbinger: right. The fact that he might be [00:24:00] willing to leave the only partner he's ever truly been happy with in order to make his daughter happy, although I don't think that breaking up would necessarily do that. I don't think it would make her happy so much as deprive her of the chance to work through the feelings that a new partner in the picture brings up.

That must speak to how hard this must be for him,

Gabriel Mizrahi: and I do feel for him there, but he probably needs to increase his capacity for that discomfort if he's gonna be the kind of parent who can help his daughter work through and heal this trauma, assuming that his fiance is not actually going out of her way to create problems, for sure.

The daughter doing something to make this work. Yeah, I gather she's not either. So on that note, I hear you that you feel tremendous guilt for not doing more to protect your daughter from her mom's boyfriend. And man, my heart aches for you because that must be such a painful feeling to live with. You decided to give this guy the benefit of the doubt.

You know, you believe that people can change. You're a kind person. I love you for that. But sadly, there are bad people in this world. A lot of people don't change, and it must be just very hard to live with. I [00:25:00] don't know if I have any easy answers there. All I can say is this guilt and this regret and this anger that you feel.

All very understandable. You can either let them sit there and consume you, or you can channel them into loving and supporting your daughter. What happened? Happened, it is awful. I'm sure it will always hurt to some degree, but you get to decide how to show up from now on. You get to choose which feelings to lead with, and you can lead with guilt and regret, or you can lead with love and hard work and dedication.

So beating yourself up for being naive, for being trusting. I get it, but it's not really gonna get you anywhere. It's not gonna help your daughter. Carving out time to spend with your daughter, continuing to fight to, you know, get her in with a therapist doing one of these courses. We talked about reading that book.

We mentioned going to therapy that will get you somewhere.

Jordan Harbinger: Also, I just wanna remind you that you are not primarily responsible for this tragedy. Her mom is. She brought a creep criminal around your daughter. She broke your agreement to vet a new partner with you and wait six months, [00:26:00] she left her alone with this garbage guy.

And I get it. As a dad, I totally understand why you feel responsible, but I also want you to be fully accurate about how this situation came about. And from where I'm sitting, her mom is primarily at fault here and that fits with a string of very poor decisions on her part. So I'm so sorry this happened, man.

This really is a parent's worst nightmare. I'm overjoyed that you have full custody now that your daughter's mom isn't making this even more difficult for you. As sad as it is that she isn't involved, you're working hard to get your daughter the help she needs. So keep showing up. Keep educating yourself.

Sit with this impulse to bail when things in the family get very distressing or intense. I think that's a big theme of your story and keep thinking about this as a marathon, not a sprint, a process, not a destination. With the right love and consistency and support from you guys, which includes a good therapist and a healthy and loving stepparent.

I really do believe your daughter can make progress here. Sending you all a big hug and wishing you all the best. Gabe, I can't help but think, man, when I read those stories about like, oh, they found out he was a [00:27:00] chomo in prison and he got beaten to death of the pipe. I'm always like, and I don't know. I just, those people, they're so awful that I just feel like the world is better off without them.

It's so gross. Now we want you to get full custody of the fine products and services that support this show. We'll be right back. This episode is sponsored in part by Quilt Mind. Most social media is just noise scrolling endlessly through people's vacation photos. Not really moving the needle in your career is it?

But LinkedIn is different. Whether you have a hundred connections or 10,000 followers, investing your time here can pay off in ways you might not expect, especially when hiring managers or potential clients look you up. That's exactly why I started working with Quilt Mind. They specialize in helping busy professionals build credibility and visibility on LinkedIn without needing to be glued to the platform all day.

I had a lot of followers just sitting there untapped. But even if you don't have thousands of followers, you likely have valuable experiences, insights, stories worth sharing. Quilt Mind helps pull those insights from you in just 30 minutes a week on a quick call, and turns them into sharp professional posts that feel authentic [00:28:00] to you.

I didn't expect much at first, but soon old colleagues were reaching out. Industry connections, were noticing real opportunities opened up. Having an active, credible LinkedIn presence can genuinely change the game no matter where you're starting from.

Jen Harbinger: If you're going to spend your time on any social platform, LinkedIn should be it, and if you want help doing it right, reach out to Jordan audience@quiltmind.com.

That's Jordan audience at Q-U-I-L-T-M-I-N d.com.

Jordan Harbinger: This episode is also sponsored by Boulevard. If you're running a salon, a barbershop, med spa, basically any business where you help people look and feel their best, your day-to-day should be just as smooth and stress free as the experience that you offer your clients.

Boulevard is the number one client experience platform built specifically for businesses like yours, appointment-based, self-care operations, that demand a personal touch. It's not just Software Boulevard is a smarter, more personalized way to manage everything from online bookings, payments, client profiles, to sending timely appointment reminders.

Boulevard provides relief from dealing with no shows or manual scheduling. Nightmares. Got multiple locations, no problem. Boulevard consolidates all [00:29:00] your needs into one easy to use platform. Plus Boulevard provides custom insights with detailed reporting and even manages memberships helping you grow your business.

Top beauty and wellness brands choose Boulevard for a reason. Check it out for yourself.

Jen Harbinger: Right now, Boulevard is offering new customers 10% off their first year subscription when you go to join blvd.com/jordan and book a demo. That's J-O-I-N-B-L vd.com/jordan. Book a demo and get 10% off your first year subscription.

Join blvd.com/jordan.

Jordan Harbinger: Thank you for listening and supporting the show. It is your support of our advertisers that keeps us going. I'm sure they're gonna love my lead pipe bit back there. Uh, the speak of the sponsors to learn more and get links to all the great discounts you hear on the show so you can check out those sponsors for yourself.

For those that remain, that is check out Jordan harbinger.com/deals. Please consider supporting those who support the. Now back to feedback Friday.

Gabriel Mizrahi: Okay, next

Jordan Harbinger: up.

Gabriel Mizrahi: Hey Jordan and Gabe. I'm Japanese and my wife is Russian. We [00:30:00] met over eight years ago through Interpols. What is that? What is Interpols? Yeah, I'd never heard of it either.

So it's basically a social network for international people where they can kind of become pen pals or learn languages together, but it's also kind of low key, a dating site for some people. I see. So he goes on, at the time she had a 10 month old baby and we first connected more as friends, like couch surfing, not dating.

We spent time together and I got to know her and her son. Things developed naturally and eventually we got married and built a life as a family here in Japan. One that I thought was stable and strong. My wife and I were together for over five years, legally married. We've been raising our son together and I've treated him like my own from the beginning.

Maury Povich Clip: You are not the guy.

Gabriel Mizrahi: Oh boy. That's the moment you chose to use that one. The one to use.

Jordan Harbinger: I got an day, she trigger finger today.

Gabriel Mizrahi: Wow, okay. But recently she told me she wants to separate because she feels that we're not emotionally compatible. She [00:31:00] said I didn't make her feel desired, that I treat her like the mother of our child, not like a woman.

She wants to co-parent now, continue living together while she becomes financially independent and divorce later when things settled down.

Jordan Harbinger: Sorry, but I, okay. I know I've used my soundbite quota for the whole show in like the one minute span, but it was worth it.

Gabriel Mizrahi: I think I know how you feel about this letter already. Mm-hmm. But we'll come back to that. So we're still living together, but emotionally she's gone. I'm still doing most of what I did before, supporting her financially, helping her with permanent residency, raising our child, and doing much of the housework.

I help with the cleaning dishes, paperwork, shopping, laundry, even cooking. But because I was so busy doing what she and her son needed, I didn't have the time or energy to do what she wanted to connect, to make her feel special, to simply be present in the way she hoped for. I don't think she's trying to take advantage of me.

I think she's being honest about how she feels, [00:32:00] but I'm stuck in this strange place trying to be kind, supportive, and strong while slowly falling apart inside. Part of me wants to believe we can fix things. Part of me knows that I'm in denial, but another part of me is afraid that I'm slowly disappearing by holding onto something that's already over.

Should I keep supporting someone who's already emotionally left me just because she can't survive alone right now? Signed. Still making the eggs even though she's flown the coop.

Jordan Harbinger: Oh man. Interesting situation. Interesting family. Yeah, there's so much more I wanna know about how you guys worked as a couple, what specific issues came up and when, but I think we get the shape of it.

So just to cut to the chase here, there might be some good reasons to keep supporting your ex-wife if she truly cannot survive on her own right now. Not just for her of course, but for the child you guys are raising together. If she truly needs your help, and she's honoring that help by appreciating it, making good use of it, putting together a concrete plan for becoming independent, or at least you know, partly independent.

In other words, if she's not [00:33:00] taking advantage of you, that's probably the right thing to do, especially in the early days. Divorces are messy. She's a foreigner in your country. She has a child to raise. This isn't easy, but man, I have a couple caveats here. One caveat is what I just mentioned, that she's not dragging this out or stringing you along because it's convenient for her.

You said you don't think she's trying to take advantage of you. Man, I don't, it sounds like you're not entirely sure, and that gives me some pause, and I do find it a little curious that she's ending the marriage but wants to divorce later when things settle down. That is a little too ambiguous for me.

She's not going, okay, I need six months to find my own place. I need to get a job. I need to stand on my own two feet. I need to get my permanent residence permit. Thank you so much for helping me get there. That I could understand. I don't know, man. It sounds to me like she has very few reasons to leave the house.

You're the chef, you're the housekeeper, you're the nanny, all that. But she does wanna officially separate so she can be free and find somebody new if she hasn't already. This could be what they call [00:34:00] monkey branching. She might not wanna let go of one branch until she finds another secure one to hold onto.

And if anyone's firing up an angry email at me for that take, just imagine if the genders were reversed in this story. This guy would be rightfully dragged from Tokyo to St. Petersburg. My other caveat is what are your reasons for continuing to support her in all these ways? Is it because you wanna be kind to her and continue to give your stepson a stable home life?

Or is it because you're secretly hoping that doing all this stuff is gonna somehow change her mind?

Gabriel Mizrahi: I get the sense that it's both because he did say that part of him wants to believe they can fix things, and part of him knows that he's in denial. So there's that.

Jordan Harbinger: Exactly. So if that is part of your motivation, I'm gonna be very direct with you and say, it is over, bud.

She told you that very clearly. And her reasons are emotional. They're not practical. So sticking around and doing all this stuff, it's not gonna change her mind. She already had that stuff before and she still made this decision. If you really wanna work on this marriage, although that's gonna require both of you to [00:35:00] wanna do that.

And again, it does not sound like she does, but if that's your goal, then you're gonna have to work on showing up for her the way that she wants. If that is something you feel you can do, if that's something you want to do, but again, I think it's probably too late. You can't fix a marriage where one person is saying, Hey, I'm sorry, but we're fundamentally incompatible and this isn't the marriage I want.

I wanna separate and just to be clear, I am not trying to be brutal here. I just hear some bargaining and denial in your letter, like you said, and I think it's important to acknowledge and respect your wife's feelings here. I know it hurts and I know that this sucks, but this is what is happening and I don't want you to operate under any illusions while you guys navigate this transition.

'cause that's only gonna make things harder.

Gabriel Mizrahi: I could not agree more. He seems to be smack in the middle of a very strange process. Mm-hmm. Things are confusing, but you're right. He doesn't need to confuse them further by not taking her at face value. He's in a bit of a complicated position, isn't he? With their son, you mean?

Yeah, like he said, they've been raising him [00:36:00] together. He's treated him like his own from the beginning, which means that he's probably responsible to continue doing that to some degree. Right. Oh, and he is also entitled to, I mean, he truly loves this kid to this kid. This is his father, for all intents and purposes.

This is his biological son, your amazing soundbite, not withstanding. So maybe that requires him to continue supporting his ex to some degree after they separate. He's effectively the kid's dad. He signed up for that or, so it seems

Jordan Harbinger: what I worry about is he has probably no legal right to see the kid at all.

So his wife can use that as leverage against him. She could also just take off and move and you know, once she's done with you and that's it. So I would either try to adopt this kid legally so that you are actually a legal parent of this child. Or I would figure out how to say goodbye because you are in a very tenuous situation here.

If this were a traditional family, there would still come a time when they'd say, okay, we're going our separate ways. Let's talk about what that looks like. Let's talk about what we each owe each other. [00:37:00] Let's come up with a plan.

Gabriel Mizrahi: Right? So your point is why should this be any different?

Jordan Harbinger: Yeah.

Gabriel Mizrahi: Okay. But just to be fair, because I do know that she might have another version of events or a different set of concerns, she is probably facing a ton of uncertainty.

Let's remember she's Russian in Japan, which not an easy place for foreigners to integrate. You kind of never really fully integrate as a foreigner. She has a lot of work to do to get on her own two feet. So maybe she legitimately needs his help.

Jordan Harbinger: I mean, I do find it a little curious that she's not like, I'm going back to Russia,

Gabriel Mizrahi: by the way.

I still need to live in Japan. But that's also a good sign for him. I mean, that means that she's not trying to take their child and run away

Jordan Harbinger: unless she just goes to another part of Japan or decides, hey, he's got another father now. Who's paying for everything? Huh? I don't know, man. I look, forgive me for being cynical, but I've seen this movie before on feedback Friday slash Fair enough.

Elsewhere enough. And look, I hear you. But she also needs to be fair about how she asks for all the help that she needs. Okay, sure. Because our friend here, how do I put it? Is he overly giving? Yeah. And it sounds to me like she's now literally living rent-free with her kid in his house while he does all the [00:38:00] work.

But they aren't actually in a marriage at all. What is he getting outta this? This is so weird to me. Mm-hmm. So go through whatever process you have to in order to accept what's happening here. That might mean intellectually accepting it before your heart does. That's okay. Have some very honest conversations with your wife about what this separation looks like, in what ways she needs your support for roughly how long.

And check in with yourself a lot to make sure that this actually feels fair and start making room for yourself in all this. Man, it sounds to me like you're catering to her in all these different ways and maybe even advancing some of your own interest in doing so while neglecting her in other ways.

But this breakup is an opportunity to reconnect with yourself and to start asking yourself what you want and what you need. And I think that's crucial while you're kind to her. And you'll be okay man. I'm sorry you're going through this bud, but it, it sounds like it kind of had to happen, sending you a big hug and wishing you all the best.

You can reach us friday@jordanharbinger.com. Keep your emails concise. Try to use descriptive subject lines. That makes our job a lot easier. If [00:39:00] you're questioning whether to withhold an inheritance from a sibling who won't leave an abusive marriage. Your beloved ex has cut all ties and rewritten you as the villain in your loving relationship.

Or your friend and his mother are being targeted and sex extorted by the Sri Lankan mafia. Still thinking about that family from last week gave was crazy. Whatever's keeping you up at night lately, hit us up friday@jordanharbinger.com. We're here to help and we keep every email anonymous. By the way, our newsletter wee bit wiser is a bite-sized gem from us to you delivered to your inbox most Wednesdays.

If you wanna keep up with the wisdom from the episodes, it's a great companion to the show. Come and check it out at Jordan harbinger.com/news.

Gabriel Mizrahi: Alright,

Jordan Harbinger: next up.

Gabriel Mizrahi: Hey, Jordan and Gabe. I've been a teacher for just over 20 years, and earlier this year I was placed on paid administrative leave. HR wouldn't tell me the reason, just that a student I had when he was seven or eight years old around 2015, so 10 years ago, and his parents made an accusation against me.

I did everything but begged for them to tell me what the accusation was, but they kept me [00:40:00] completely in the dark for over a week. After eight days, my union lawyer and I learned that the student said that 10 years prior, I had called him back into the classroom and that I quote unquote aggressively fondled his genitals.

He stated that it only happened that one time. It was a complete lie. They wouldn't tell me the student's name, but said I would find it out When I had to go to HR with my lawyer to get interviewed by their lawyer at the interview, I was told of the full accusation and asked to respond. I told them that the accusations were a complete lie.

My classroom routines, which I've done since my first year, more than 20 years ago, prevent any student from being in the classroom alone with me. Another male teacher told me to do this when I was brand new. He was a veteran teacher who had been falsely accused 15 years ago. Teachers, he said, need to be out of the classroom before all of the students leave the room.

Once everybody's outta the room, the teacher would be in full view of all the students while the last student closes the classroom door. That way you'll never be in the room with the [00:41:00] last student in line, the place in line that my accuser claimed he was in, and you'll have 28 ish student witnesses. See, you do this four or five times every day.

Jordan Harbinger: This is so depressing that perfectly normal teachers have to CYA like this. But it makes sense. Yeah, it's smart. It's just depressing.

Gabriel Mizrahi: Yeah. Pro tip for all the teachers out there, I guess, man, that is, that is insane. But I, I guess I, I get it. 'cause stuff like this happens. So she goes on. The interview lasted no more than 20 minutes.

They had a five minute discussion with us out of the room, invited us back in and told me I was free to go back to my classroom. The month from hell was over. I was so relieved, so much so that I didn't think to ask why I was being cleared so quickly, or if the student admitted to fabricating his story.

My lawyer said he had never seen a teacher in his 50 years of experience get exonerated at the first interview. The only explanation I can think of is that the student admitted that he lied. When I returned to work, everybody welcomed me back with open arms. I only told four of my most trusted colleagues, but my colleagues [00:42:00] all deal with the same concerns.

A teacher doesn't just disappear for a month for no reason, and we all know that some asshole kid can falsely accuse you of anything at any time. Thank goodness we're paid so well, right?

Jordan Harbinger: Yeah. My mom was a teacher for many years. It is absolutely abominable. The things that you all put up with are insane, and I think it's only gotten worse in the last 20 years

Gabriel Mizrahi: after all of this.

I looked up the school yearbook from that year. I hate to say it, but I remember him now, and the kid was a little shit back then. Always sarcastic and mischievous. A liar, always in the middle of something. I'm assuming he's about 18 now, as he'll be graduating from another school this year. Despite his academic performance, and despite the fact that he did this to me, I've suffered from anxiety and depression my entire life.

This false accusation threw me into one of the worst depressions of my life. Suicide has always been something I've thought of, but I never made a plan. I made a plan this time. My spouse and parents got me to agree to go to a [00:43:00] psychiatrist.

Jordan Harbinger: Wow. This is a interesting theme on today's episode. Again, I'm so glad you got help when you needed it, but I'm I'm very sorry this threw you for such a loop.

What a little piece of crap this kid is.

Gabriel Mizrahi: This was literally a lifesaver. I've only gone to my psychiatrist for about two months, but I can't believe how much improvement I already feel. The only problem is that my psychiatrist doesn't take insurance and at $350 a session, it's making it very difficult to budget for these appointments.

I now desperately want to get out of the classroom. Every time a student stands too close, I get nervous and just put my hands up and tell them to scoop back. I've even snapped. Don't touch me at a couple of students who have tapped my shoulder to get my attention as much as I want to be. I'm not the same teacher I was.

The thought of doing this for much longer is so disturbing multiple times a day. I wonder if one of these students is gonna attack me in 10 years.

Jordan Harbinger: So this sounds like textbook PTSD. Yeah. And I'm, man, I'm sorry. This did such a number on you.

Gabriel Mizrahi: I wanna file a civil suit against the family who accused me, but none of the three [00:44:00] lawyers I reached out to have returned my requests.

I think the family should be paying for my psychiatrist appointments. I was gonna retire in eight years, but I qualify for retirement in only three years. If I do retire in three years, I would need to get a job. If I were to retire in eight years, I would be free to retire without one. I'm lost. What do I do?

Do I just forget about this, if the district knew that it was a false accusation before my interview, can I take legal action against them since they put me through extra days or weeks of anxiety and depression? Or are lawyers not returning my call because I don't have a case? Signed a teacher saying, yikes, when her blood pressure spikes because of this twisted Tyke who did a real number on her life.

Jordan Harbinger: Oh man, this sucks. I mean, all things considered this turned out well, the investigation, I mean, the totally unnecessary and completely ridiculous air quotes investigation, but it unequivocally went your way. Weeks of anxiety and depression notwithstanding, and you put yourself in the best possible [00:45:00] position by following that teacher's advice and being a totally normal teacher.

It is so sad and aggravating that teachers have to deal with false accusations, even the threat of this stuff, it's so bleak and depressing. But then we've also heard from students who were actually abused by their teachers. So I suppose this process exists for a reason. Anyway, you're asking an interesting question.

I'm not sure there's one right answer here. On one hand, you're clearly traumatized. You're clearly disenchanted with teaching, or at least with the public school system. Eight years is, that's a long time, so you could argue, you know, listen to your heart, get out of the environment in three years, start a new chapter, be happy, which totally fair.

Definitely an option. On the other hand, you still have three years until you can retire and collect your pension. So you're gonna have to find a way to survive in this environment and take good care of yourself until then, and even after you leave this post-traumatic response you're left with, it sounds pretty distressing.

You're clearly freaked out by what happened and understandably so. Although I think it's partly because of how nerve wracking the [00:46:00] investigation process was, and partly because of how you were wired or conditioned beforehand, and partly because of how you're working through the experience. Now, like I said, I am thrilled that you saw a psychiatrist when you were at a low point, and I'm thrilled that whatever treatment they gave you is helped so much.

That is great news, modern science for the win. But I also hear that the anxiety, the post-traumatic response, they're still pretty intense. And I know from talking to so many experts on the show and hearing so many feedback Friday letters, I know it doesn't have to be that way. I would love for you to get to a point where your students don't trigger you in this way, where going back into the classroom doesn't bring all this up again, not just so you can get through the next three years, but so you can heal and grow and just be the highest functioning person possible.

We've heard remarkable things about EMDR therapy for trauma, for example. The results are pretty insane from what I've heard. I, I know money is an issue for you. I totally get it, but I also wonder if you could find some low cost or sliding scale options or find someone through your teacher's insurance [00:47:00] doing EMDR with a good therapist.

It might just put these memories where they belong in the brain and help you process whatever residual pain is left from this experience. I'm not a doctor, so I don't know a lot about this, but we've just heard so many good things about it.

Gabriel Mizrahi: Also, EMDR in many cases is often more goal oriented and it can be shorter term, especially for people who have one main traumatic event that they wanna work on.

So this would not necessarily be an ongoing expense for you. You might think of it as a one-time investment for what it's worth, and also not the only type of therapy, just one that is known to be particularly effective with trauma.

Jordan Harbinger: What I'm curious to know is if she makes some progress in this department, if she can reduce the trauma symptoms.

Will the classroom still feel as dangerous? Will she still feel the need to leave? Or is three to eight years, is that just gonna feel very different afterwards?

Gabriel Mizrahi: That's something only she can answer when she gets there. But I have to imagine the answer is yes, I think so. And that changes her whole calculus.

Jordan Harbinger: Exactly. Same here. But either way, I would really start working on this as soon as possible, whether it's in therapy or reading books about trauma, or talking about this with [00:48:00] the right people, or finding some other outlets. It was not your fault that this kid falsely accused you, but it is your responsibility to not let an event like this an event created by some troubled, weird, dysfunctional kid to ruin your life.

Gabriel Mizrahi: And given your history. I think it's likely that there are probably a few earlier formative experiences that have informed how you responded to all of this, how you processed it. So you could say, eh, this is just the false accusation. I'm gonna bite the bullet for three years and then it'll just be behind me.

I would argue that tackling this stuff now would actually be a window into some even more profound work and perhaps some older stuff that would benefit you massively for the rest of your life and not just in the classroom.

Jordan Harbinger: As for the litigation question, I'm not sure if these lawyers aren't returning your call 'cause you don't have a case.

I mean, it's possible. Most attorneys are quite motivated by money. Maybe they think you need to talk to your union first and get a lawyer through them. I don't know. It's also possible you haven't found the right attorney yet. I'm not a litigation expert by any means, but my gut is telling [00:49:00] me this might be a hard case.

'cause first of all, minors generally lack the capacity to be sued in the same way adults can. Any lawsuit involving a child would typically need to be filed against the parents or guardians and it, it's gonna be very hard to prove that they falsely accused you knowing that the claims were false. They could easily say, my child said his teacher molested him.

Of course I filed a report and that could very well be what happened. Also, in most states, parents are not automatically liable for everything their child does. If memory serves. Parents might only be liable if they were negligent in supervising the child, or if there's a statute in your state that says, Hey, parents have limited financial liability for certain acts their children do.

And even then those damages are usually capped at a few thousand dollars.

Gabriel Mizrahi: Hmm, interesting. So hardly worth it.

Jordan Harbinger: Yeah, not really. I mean, we're talking about a claim for intentional infliction of emotional distress, and that's really hard even when there's really clear malice involved and it's just a very hard thing to prove when the defendant is not a minor.

The attorney's only gonna get a percentage of that if they take [00:50:00] this case on contingency. So they're just doing the math,

Gabriel Mizrahi: you know? So there's not much to be gained here other than the satisfaction of winning.

Jordan Harbinger: And the satisfaction of winning ain't gonna pay for visits to the psychiatrist. I'll tell you that.

As for the school district, I don't see any evidence here that they knew it was a false accusation before your interview. It sounds like they got the accusation, they reviewed the evidence, they took testimony from the parties. They pretty quickly saw, okay, this is total BS from a BS kid who's been BSing his whole life in the school district, and we rule in favor of the teacher.

Gabriel Mizrahi: Maybe I'm naive, but I just can't imagine the district going through an investigation knowing 100% for sure that an accusation is false. The more likely scenario is that whether they believe the initial evidence or not. They had to go through this process just as a matter of policy. Maybe their findings, confirm their initial opinion, maybe not.

But the process is the process.

Jordan Harbinger: Yeah. 'cause there is an alternative world where you come in and they say, Hey, he said this. And you go, well it was an accident. Mm. And I didn't mean to, or something like that. And then they're like, oh, okay. So she sort of [00:51:00] acknowledges that something, but might have happened.

But then you went in and you were like, this is total bs. This kid's a liar. And they were like, yeah, we kind of already knew that. Alright, we have you on record as saying this. We have no evidence that this actually happened. And the kid recanted half of it the day after. Done and dusted. My sense is that she's very angry and hurt.

Obviously she's looking for someone to blame. I can absolutely appreciate that. This kid is the obvious culprit. He sounds like a real piece of work, but you could also argue he's a minor. He's confused, he's unwell, he's an idiot. Whatever the school district look, there's plenty to criticize her education system for, I'm just not sure that they intentionally inflicted this pain on her friend here.

I just, I don't know about that.

Gabriel Mizrahi: Well, you're getting at the real theme of her letter for me, which is what's gonna make me feel better? Who's gonna make this right?

Jordan Harbinger: Yeah.

Gabriel Mizrahi: I thought it was very interesting when she said, can I take legal action against the district since they put me through extra days or weeks of anxiety and depression?

But to your point earlier, Jordan, that is not exactly the full story. It's true that she experienced a much more severe anxiety and depression during those days or weeks. It's also [00:52:00] true that she was particularly vulnerable to those feelings even before this happened, and that she had some of them already.

Jordan Harbinger: Yes.

Gabriel Mizrahi: And that she might not have been equipped to handle this period of extreme fear and uncertainty, which as we all know, does a real number on people who struggle with anxiety. So it's like, did the school district do that to her? Did this kid do that to her? Did she do this? Did her history do this? I mean, how do you parse a perfect storm?

Jordan Harbinger: Exactly. And what you're sort of scratching at is where's the line between appropriate blame and productive responsibility?

Gabriel Mizrahi: Yes, exactly.

Jordan Harbinger: Did this kid ruin her life and career? Yeah. In some ways. Is she also maybe inadvertently kind of letting him do that perhaps by not finding ways of working through this trauma or by hoping she can retire early?

I think maybe also, yes, a little bit. And I wanna be clear, you are not wrong to want somebody to pay for your psychiatrist at 350 bucks a pop. It's insane that you have to pay that to get medication that's keeping you healthy and alive. I hate this dumb ass kid with the fire of a thousand sons, okay? [00:53:00] And it's true that this experience laid bare some important things about you that are now yours to address.

And as we talk about from time to time, so much of life is out of our control. We can only control how we respond. And by the way, this kid, I don't know how many times I need to highlight this, but I'm gonna do it again. This kid is not a winner. He is a mess. He is a liar. He is fabricating claims against his teacher from 10 years ago.

As a, an adult or a near adult life is gonna be very hard for this loser ass kid. Okay? Trust me, my feeling is that's probably all the justice he needs to get. So, no, I'm not sure. You should just forget about this, but I think you need to shift your lens here. The question isn't who's gonna pay, but rather what do I have to learn?

Where do I need to grow? How do I need to take care of myself? Yes. If you really take that on, you'll know whether you should retire in three years or eight years or find another job or just enjoy retirement. That is secondary. Understanding yourself and your healing, [00:54:00] that is primary. Sending you a big hug, my friend.

We're rooting for you and now you get to aggressively fond the deals and discounts on the fine products and services that support this show. We'll be right back.

This episode is sponsored in part by open phone. If you're running a business, every missed call is a lost opportunity. Ever had an urgent situation? You call a business only to be greeted by silence or some voicemail. You call the next person on your list, and if they answer, they got the business. That is exactly why your business needs open phone.

Open phone is the number one business phone system that completely streamlines customer communications. It works right through an app on your phone or computer. You don't have to carry two phones. Open phone lets your entire team share one business number and handle calls and texts together like a shared inbox.

If you're unavailable, your teammates can easily step in picking up the conversation right where you left off, which means faster responses and happier customers. Also, open phones. AI assistant can handle after hours calls, answer common questions, capture leads for you, ensuring no customer slips through the cracks.

Whether you're a solo entrepreneur getting buried in your calls, or you manage a big team needing solid [00:55:00] collaboration, open phone makes your life way easier. Over 60,000 businesses already trust open phone. Check it out. Jen will tell you how to get a discount.

Jen Harbinger: Open phone is offering our listeners 20% off your first six months@openphone.com slash Jordan.

That's O-P-E-N-P-H-O-N e.com/jordan. And if you have existing numbers with another service, open phone will port them over at no extra charge. Open phone, no missed calls, no missed customers.

Jordan Harbinger: This episode is also sponsored by Shopify. When I first started my podcast business, it was overwhelming. I had to figure out branding and scripts and filming setups and marketing stuff I didn't even know existed.

I really wish I'd had a competent business partner to simplify things and help me get off the ground if only I had Shopify. Shopify is the commerce platform, powering millions of businesses worldwide and supporting about 10% of all e-commerce in the us. We're talking brands you know and love like Mattel, Jim Shark, as well as entrepreneurs that are just starting off.

Here's what's cool. Shopify makes it ridiculously easy to launch your own online store with hundreds of professionally designed templates that match your brand's unique style. [00:56:00] Shopify can craft email campaigns, social media ads to reach your customers wherever they're scrolling. Plus, Shopify offers world-class expertise in everything from managing inventory to international shipping and returns.

They handle the logistics so you can focus on the creative parts of your business. Bottom line, if you're ready to sell, you're ready for Shopify.

Jen Harbinger: Turn your big business idea into with Shopify on your side. Sign up for your $1 per month trial and start selling today@shopify.com slash Jordan. Go to shopify.com/jordan shopify.com/jordan.

Jordan Harbinger: I've got homes.com is a sponsor for this episode. homes.com knows what when it comes to home shopping. It's never just about the house or the condo. It's about the homes. And what makes a home is more than just the house or property. It's the location. It's the neighborhood. If you got kids, it's also schools nearby parks, transportation options.

That's why homes.com goes above and beyond To bring home shoppers, the in-depth information they need to find the right home. It's so hard not to say home every single time. And when I [00:57:00] say in-depth information, I'm talking deep. Each listing features comprehensive information about the neighborhood complete with a video guide.

They also have details about local schools with test scores, state rankings, student teacher ratio. They even have an agent directory with the sales history of each agent. So when it comes to finding a home, not just a house, this is everything you need to know all in one place. homes.com. We've done your homework.

If you like this episode of Feedback Friday and you find our advice valuable, I invite you to do what other smart and considerate listeners do, which is take a moment, support the sponsors that make the show possible. All of the deals, discount codes, and ways to support this podcast are searchable and clickable on the website at Jordan harbinger.com/deals.

You can also email us if you can't find a code or something's not working for you. We are happy to surface 'em for you because it's that important that you support those who support the show. Alright, back to feedback Friday and now for the recommendation of the week. I am addicted to Lit filler. My recommendation of the week is an app called Sniff Spot.

This one came [00:58:00] from our subreddit. Sniff Spot is basically Airbnb for dog parks. Some people they have, what are they called? Reactive dogs, or you get a rescue, or you got a puppy that's all over the place, or a small dog. That's where this app comes in. Basically, you are renting someone's fenced in yard or some sort of private piece of land.

So there's not other dogs, not other animals there. I think you can kind of, you know, let your dog poop and it gets taken care of, that kind of thing. It's a really good idea and a lot of people in the subreddit were like, I use this or I need this. So I thought I'd throw it in the recommendation of the week.

It's a really good idea and like I said, it came from the sub Reddit, and if you don't know about that subreddit, it's a great place to jump into discussions with other listeners about specific episodes. So if there's something you like, something you don't like, you want updates on past feedback, Friday stories, whatever, you wanna ride that do's cruise along with us.

Come on and check it out. There's a lot of cool conversations happening over there from episodes to recommendations to all kinds of really interesting off topic stuff as well. That's the Jordan Harbinger subreddit. Come on and join us. Alright, what's next?

Gabriel Mizrahi: Dear Jordan and [00:59:00] Gabe, I'm in my early fifties and about a year ago I was released from my job of nearly 18 years and given a payout of nearly a year's wages.

Nice. I was fortunate that I found a new job in my industry with a company with excellent brand recognition, higher pay, and a great team of people to work with. I've made so many friends and we share plenty of laughs, but I'm finding the work not very interesting and the workplace politics are very frustrating.

I often finish work exhausted and with very little achieved, I'm not getting a great sense of satisfaction and like most jobs, it has its pressures and stress. I can be prone to anxiety and I've been doing the same job for 28 years. I'm tired of it. I feel like I wanna leave this career behind and retire, or at least do something else.

I wanna spend time with my elderly parents, travel and focus on my health and my hobbies. I want to do all the stuff that I want to while I still can. I've done all the calculations. It's very doable. I'm in relatively good [01:00:00] health. I've never been married. I have no dependents. I own my own home, plus two other homes outright that I rent out and I'm debt free.

I have healthy cash reserves and a very sizable portfolio and retirement fund. The income I earn from investments will comfortably pay my living expenses and leave me enough to still enjoy myself. So even though I have a well paying job, I don't need it.

Jordan Harbinger: Daddy chill. You've got nothing to worry about, dude.

Sounds like you got it all figured out.

Gabriel Mizrahi: Plus, because I already earn money from my investments, my salary is heavily taxed in my country. But I also know that if I leave, I will almost certainly never be able to work in this industry again. I will never be able to take out a mortgage again if I need to.

I've been catastrophizing about all kinds of things. What if I get sick? What if I need an operation? What if I need a new car? How will I keep busy? What if the world economy goes into a downturn? The list goes on. I'll also miss the fun times I've had with my colleagues. I don't know where my purpose will come from without work.

I'm worried that [01:01:00] I'll regret giving up this job that someone else would give their right arm for. This feels like the biggest decision of my life. What should I do? Is there something glaringly obvious that I'm not seeing? Signed, hesitating to set sale because I'm afraid that I'll fail and ultimately bewail this high stakes fairytale.

Jordan Harbinger: Gabe, since you're our new resident nomad and you made that Carl Young book wreck last week, I feel like this one's for you. You wanna take the lead here? Sure. I would love to.

Gabriel Mizrahi: I'm not retired, just FYI. Although I do own a Panama hat that would suggest otherwise, but um, yeah. Yeah. I totally get the urge to make a big change and travel and enjoy your life while you still have it.

So, okay. First of all, well done on building such a successful career and for taking such good care of yourself financially. That is incredible, and I'm sure that's not an accident. You are in a very enviable position here and it sounds to me like you've set yourself up to make a transition like this with what sounds like very little risk.

I mean, from a money perspective, dude, you, [01:02:00] you are basically set.

Jordan Harbinger: If anything, it might make more sense for him to quit his job even if he doesn't travel, given that he is being taxed so heavily on his salary. That is, yeah, if his work isn't giving him much satisfaction and he values his time more,

Gabriel Mizrahi: which he clearly does, but then you do have some opportunity costs and that's really what your letter is about.

Making a bold choice, opening new doors when doing that will also mean closing some doors behind you. There are always opportunity costs in life. There is no free lunch ever, unfortunately. So part of our job is just getting friendly with that fact. More importantly, it's the opportunity costs that tell us what truly matters.

And we also talk about this from time to time, so if you could leave your job and travel and spend time with your parents and focus on your health without having to give up anything. It would not mean as much. So what we say no to tells us how valuable the yes is, and that goes in both directions.

Whether you retire or whether you stay in your job, either way, intentionally or [01:03:00] unintentionally, you will be saying these things matter more to me than those things. So I get why this is anxiety provoking and you already run a little anxious. So there's probably some overthinking happening here. And also, anxiety, as we all know, is ultimately an attempt at control.

And what you're thinking about doing right now, which is leaving a familiar structured environment and stepping into this unfamiliar open-ended one that is going to involve a letting go and an embracing of uncertainty, which is the exact opposite of control.

Jordan Harbinger: But that's also part of the beauty of this experience, that he doesn't quite know what's waiting for him.

Gabriel Mizrahi: Totally. But that can be really hard, even for people who don't run anxious. I mean, it was hard for me too, and I don't even have a traditional corporate job with a study, you know, structure and peers and salary and all of that, right? So I'll offer you just a couple ideas that help me finally make this decision for myself.

The first thing is when I was debating whether to leave LA go traveling, I kept thinking, okay, I'm giving up my apartment. [01:04:00] I can't just come back to my city if this doesn't work out. And the real estate market in LA is so crazy, and especially after the wildfires that we had earlier this year, if I have to come back and I, I'm gonna have to look for a while and I'll have to pay way more and I won't have a presence in la which is where my industry is.

And, and what if I move to Portugal or Japan or whatever and I hate it, and this whole trip is a bust and I can't come home and blah, blah, blah. All these, my God whining, huge

Jordan Harbinger: risks. Geez,

Gabriel Mizrahi: this was my internal monologue for, oh my God, several weeks,

Jordan Harbinger: give it a rest.

Gabriel Mizrahi: But then I sat with it and I was like, okay, but also you're kind of dying here.

You know, like you're stagnant. You're paying a considerable amount in rent every month for a place that you don't own, that you're not in love with. Your life has gotten very predictable. Time is your greatest asset and you're spending it in a place that, yeah, generally lovely, beautiful, comfortable. But it's not challenging you.

It's not making you happy. You have these needs and these goals that you're not pursuing. So aren't those risks too, in fact, aren't those [01:05:00] actually in some ways, bigger risks?

Jordan Harbinger: Yeah, that is. That is so true, man. That feeling of your life starting to feel too small or it's passing you by, that gets even scarier as you get older.

Take it from me, realize that you, you realize that tomorrow. That is right now,

Gabriel Mizrahi: yeah.

Jordan Harbinger: And that's a little bit scary. That's a little unnerving.

Gabriel Mizrahi: It's intense, man. And if you are into that, then you should read that young book I recommended last week. 'cause that really speaks to that felt experience of time and how precious it is.

Once I saw that this decision became pretty easy, and I'm not even in the financial position that our friend here is in, it was just like, given where I am in my life and what I value staying was actually more reckless than leaving. It just didn't look that way because it was familiar. So the truly risky thing was familiar and normal.

The actually not so risky, pretty awesome thing, looked scary and costly, but only because it was different. So the way we measure risk as human beings is really interesting, and I think we need to be very thoughtful, very intentional about how we do [01:06:00] that.

Jordan Harbinger: Totally agree. So for him, the costs are staying at a job that's draining him, not being able to spend time with his parents.

Not being able to invest in his health and his hobbies, not enjoying his life and missing out on the extra income, which isn't even that much after taxes. 'cause he's a low key baller

Gabriel Mizrahi: and not enjoying his colleague's company, which apparently matters quite a bit to him.

Jordan Harbinger: But honestly, I think that cost is pretty low.

He could still see colleagues, you can still make friends. Right. The upsides are, well, uh, his whole life on his terms. Yeah. Time with himself, time with his parents, independence, happiness, health, which he can totally afford.

Gabriel Mizrahi: Yeah. And by the way, he's in a place to do this responsibly. Like he's clearly not being reckless, he's not setting himself up for disaster.

Jordan Harbinger: That's what makes all this realistic. If the money piece we're less secure, I wouldn't necessarily say no, but I'd have more reservations.

Gabriel Mizrahi: The second thing I'll share with you is it's really hard to do a cost benefit analysis in the abstract, especially for the benefit part. Right now, the costs are very vivid.

No salary, no colleagues, no purpose, no ability to [01:07:00] reenter the industry. Um, no taking out a mortgage. I guess, although,

Jordan Harbinger: just to jump in for a second, I'm not sure I totally buy those last two things. Okay. Maybe it'll be hard for him to get a job in this industry again, at his age. He knows best, but also, I don't know if that's as fixed as he seems to think.

If you have great relationships, a solid reputation, something valuable to offer, you just never know. So that door might not be entirely closed. About the mortgage. Look, I don't know how it works in your country, but in most countries if you don't have a salary but you do have substantial passive income, fully owned assets, a low debt to income ratio, you can totally still qualify for a mortgage.

It might be a little bit more complicated, but it is not impossible. I just wanted to chime in on that 'cause it is really important to investigate every one of these assumptions as you make this decision. And I also wonder if maybe the anxiety is playing up some of these risks catastrophizing as you put it.

Mm-hmm. Which I'm glad you see so clearly in that's maybe skewing your calculation.

Gabriel Mizrahi: Yeah. Really good points. I'm glad you chimed in on that. 'cause I was wondering the same when you said the mortgage thing and like there were [01:08:00] so many reasons and I'm like, hmm, are all of those true? But okay, so those risks feel more real to you right now because they are things that you have, whereas the upsides, traveling, having new experiences, freedom, those are a lot more abstract.

You don't know exactly which countries you're gonna visit. You don't know what amazing things you'll do with your parents. You know, you don't know which amazing people you're gonna meet when you're traveling, or what specific hobbies you're gonna pursue and become great at, or where these interests are gonna take you.

So that was something else I had to account for too, and it took me a little while to appreciate. It is easier to freak out about losing something you have than it is to get excited about enjoying something you don't have yet.

Jordan Harbinger: Wow. Yeah. Well I wish I'd known that 20 years ago. It's easier to freak out about losing something you have than it is to get excited about enjoying something you don't have yet.

That is

Gabriel Mizrahi: yes,

Jordan Harbinger: like simple, but quite profound I think.

Gabriel Mizrahi: So you have to trust that those benefits will get more specific with time and the fact that they are unknown to Jordan's point a moment [01:09:00] ago. That is also part of their value. If like me, you are into living an adventurous, surprising life.

Jordan Harbinger: Also, part of your job is to make those benefits specific.

Yes. Come up with some goals for yourself. Put some trips on the calendar. Maybe take your parents on one. Really invest in these hobbies, join a gym, whatever it is, then you'll really know what it is that you're choosing.

Gabriel Mizrahi: All that said, though, I am glad that he understands that this is gonna be a big transition.

I mean, he's going to have to create new purpose in his life if he doesn't have his job anymore. That's big.

Jordan Harbinger: Yeah. His sources of meaning are gonna have to change, and that might be a bit of a shock. There might be times where he is like, oh my God, what have I done? What is my life about? But again. That's why you have to be intentional here.

You gotta nurture your close relationships. You gotta create meaningful experiences. You gotta keep focusing on your investments and your properties. Maybe work toward buying another with that mortgage. You can almost certainly qualify for your purpose. Doesn't have to be tethered to your job, man, but I'm glad that you know that this is gonna be a shift and I can, I can relate like purpose, tether to job.

I, trust me, I can relate. [01:10:00]

Gabriel Mizrahi: I totally get it. And also like how he manages his time. I mean, I think the trouble begins when you make a big change like this and then you know you're drinking at 3:00 PM and you're sleeping until 11 and you don't really have anywhere to be, and you're not actually doing stuff like that could be a very different life.

I'm also really interested in this thing. He said that he's worried that he's gonna regret giving up this job that someone else would give their right arm for. Interesting.

Jordan Harbinger: Yeah, that jumped out at me too. It's funny 'cause he literally, he's going, oh, this work sucks. I hate the politics. I go home exhausted.

I'm not achieving anything. I'm not satisfied. It's stressful. I'm sick and tired of it. Ah, but somebody else would kill to have this job, so I should definitely keep it. You're not that other person. Who cares what they want.

Gabriel Mizrahi: I mean, yeah. But it's such a tempting thing to do. I get why he's thinking that way.

But again, I think he really needs to consider how he values things. If he's valuing this job simply because somebody else, some theoretical person who does not share his goals and values or his enviable financial position because they would want it, that is not a good valuation. That is outsourcing your rubric of what's important to someone else or to [01:11:00] society.

The real question is, how do you value it, man? Is it necessary? Is it feeding you the way that you wanna be fed at the stage of your life? Again. If you're not gonna become broke or homeless because of this, that is really all that matters

Jordan Harbinger: for sure. So that's our take that it's mostly a guess from me, given the facts here, but it's your life in my view.

The only glaringly obvious thing you're missing is that life is made up of a handful of big decisions that involve trade-offs, and you have to accept them if you want to live boldly and authentically,

Gabriel Mizrahi: and that this really is your one and only life, as trite as that is. Mm-hmm. It is so true. It's something that I'm contending with myself and it's minorly terrifying, but it's also really exciting when you start to make good use of it.

So wanting to make the most of your time and your health and your relationships, including the ones you have with your parents while you have them, is key and in my opinion, very beautiful.

Jordan Harbinger: I agree. And if there are a few contingencies you wanna plan for, if your car breaks down, you need an operation.

Sure. Budget for that. Come up with a plan, emergency fund, whatever. Make sure you always have a little cushion so you're not freaking out. That's just [01:12:00] part of doing this thoughtfully. You can catastrophize in a way that paralyzes you or you can catastrophize in a way that empowers you. If you pull the trigger, maybe you and Gabe can meet up somewhere in the world, possibly overtaxed Europe, but someplace with healthcare and take a selfie in your matching Panama hats.

Gabriel Mizrahi: Yeah, the official headgear of the semi-retired. That's right.

Jordan Harbinger: Exactly. Congrats on making it to this point and good luck. Go back and check out Eddie Fishman, if you haven't done so yet. The best things that have happened in my life in business, they come through my network, the circle of people that I know, like and trust.

I'm teaching you how to build the same thing for yourself in our six minute networking course. It is free. There's no shenanigans. It's not schmoozy. I don't need your credit card, none of that. You can find it on the Thinkific platform@sixminutenetworking.com. The drills take a few minutes per day is really it.

And this stuff I wish I knew 20 years ago. Dig the well before you get thirsty. Build relationships before you need them. You can find it all@sixminutenetworking.com. Show notes and transcripts on the website, advertisers, deals, discounts, ways to support the show, all at Jordan harbinger.com/deals. I'm at [01:13:00] Jordan Harbinger on Twitter and Instagram.

You can also connect with me on LinkedIn. Gabe's over on Instagram at Gabriel Mizrahi as well. This show is created in association with PodcastOne. My team is Jen Harbinger, Jase Sanderson, Robert Fogarty, Ian Baird, Tadas Sidlauskas, and of course, Gabriel Mizrahi. Our advice and opinions are our own. I might be a lawyer, but I'm certainly not your lawyer, so do your own research before implementing anything you hear on the show.

Remember, we rise by lifting others. Share the show with those you love. If you found the episode useful, please share it with somebody else who could use the advice we gave here today. In the meantime, I hope you apply what you hear on the show so you can live what you learn, and we'll see you next time.

What happens when you speak out against Vladimir Putin and the KGB starts showing up in your life outside of Russia? Constantine, Somo love didn't just flee his homeland to avoid conscription. He's now exposing the regime from abroad with a target on his back.

JHS Clip: I was growing up on the impression that the USA was the cradle of all evil in the world.

Okay? It was bad. And then the world started opening up and I understood that the communists [01:14:00] were lying. Imagine for 70 years you are told that nothing good for people in the West. It's darkness there none. And Russia thought that we could invade Ukraine, and then I was absolutely caught of guarded. It's unbelievable.

The Russian state didn't care about what was being said about it on the outside. All they cared was on the inside. But now the focus has shifted on telling the truth about Russia, how things are, and my YouTube channel started growing. The numbers exploded 'cause everyone wanted to be a part of a community, a support group, and I think that I'm becoming a bigger and bigger danger to them.

So they're trying to neutralize me one way or another, and knowing that I am on the radar is one thing. But when you see actually an agent in real life that's different ball game, I'm not stopping. I keep on talking because I was silent [01:15:00] for 15 years. I was looking at my country going down to hell, and I wasn't doing anything about it.

So there's no way they're gonna shut me up even if I put myself into more danger. I think that's more important right now to tell the truth of what's really happening in Russia, if not me, than who

Jordan Harbinger: to hear more about life under dictatorship, the myths of Russian strength and what it really costs to tell the truth.

Check out episode 1021 of The Jordan Harbinger Show.