292: My Wife Wants Another Kid, But I Don’t | Feedback Friday

Transcript for My Wife Wants Another Kid, But I Don't | Feedback Friday (Episode 292)

Jordan Harbinger: [00:00:03] Welcome to Feedback Friday. I'm your host Jordan Harbinger, and I'm here with producer Jason DeFillippo. On The Jordan Harbinger Show, we decode the stories, secrets, and skills of the world's most brilliant and interesting people, and turn their wisdom into practical advice that you can use to impact your own life and those around you.

[00:00:20] And this week we had Doug Williams discussing how the polygraph test, the lie detector. The lie detector test is a lie. It actually harms national security and destroys careers. And then I'm giving the team a break this Thursday and next Thursday for the holidays. So no, there's nothing wrong with your player. We're just giving people a little break ski pooh, well-needed rest. Also, I write every so often on the blog, the latest post is about flakiness epidemic. Here's looking at you, everyone alive. Don't point at millennials, you flake to whoever you are. You've got to do what you say you're going to do because it's bad for you if you don't, not just for other people. It's also bad for you. I explain a little bit of the science behind this, so make sure you've had a look and a listen to everything we created for you this week. The articles are available at jordanharbinger.com/articles. I also post them on Facebook. If you're that person who's still looking at my Facebook stuff, it's also there, The Jordan Harbinger Show page on Facebook, but again, just go to the website people, come on, jordanharbinger.com/articles and the podcasts they're on the feed as you are well aware.

[00:01:24] Of course, our primary mission here on The Jordan Harbinger Show is to pass along our guests' and our own insights and experience to you. I want to have a conversation directly with you, and that's what we do today and every Friday here on Feedback Friday. I just want to put one brick in the structure that makes up your life, and that's what this podcast really is about. You can reach us at friday@jordanharbinger.com.

[00:01:46] And if you want to go to prison with me on the birthday, February 26, 2020. Got some spots left, not a ton. This thing filled up really, really, really fast, and then we opened up some spots and then those filled up really, really, really fast. I have to say, I am very pleasantly surprised at how many of you want to go to a maximum-security prison with me to do an educational program with the inmates outside of Reno, Nevada, February 26, 2020. it's about 900 bucks plus travel. But when I say travel, I mean hotels are literally 50 bucks a night. We've got a block and flights to Reno, depending on where you are, probably not too expensive. And 900 bucks, that goes entirely to the educational program for the inmates and bus travel to and from Reno. It's not a whole lot of a mass transit going to high desert maximum security detention center. So we've got a bus for you and it includes lunch. But other than that, the money goes directly to the program. So it's a good cause. It's going to be a hell of a lot of fun. And if you want to come with us, a couple of spots left, well, several spots left. I'll make room for you. How's that? Email me at prison@jordanharbinger.com. All right, Jason, what's the first thing out of the mailbag?

Jason DeFillippo: [00:02:53] Hi, Jordan and Jason. My wife and I have two beautiful boys and our youngest is just over a year old. Fatherhood has been one of the most challenging and yet rewarding experiences of my life. I wouldn't change a thing, but a couple of months ago, my wife began pushing for a third. We always discussed having to then stopping. On top of that, our first was a very poor sleeper and also very headstrong. In some ways, I feel like I'm still not fully recovered. I know part of what's driving her is that she always wanted a girl, and if the situation were reversed, I might be asking for another chance to have a boy, but I just don't think I can do this. And yet when I tell her that honestly, she's obviously very hurt. She wants me to trust her and take a chance. Like most dads, I worry about our finances, but I'm also concerned about our health. This would be her third C-section, and I also have some side projects that I've been working on for a long time, and I don't want to lose my momentum. I'm worried that I'm being too selfish, but I really want to focus on my own happiness too. I feel like I've never really put my interests first. I'm that guy who always worked too hard and sacrificed everything else, including hobbies, friends, et cetera. On the other hand, I agree with her and don't want to regret this down the road. I can always still work on my projects, but the window to have another child is very finite. I also hate disappointing her. What should I do? Sincerely, Go for Third or Stick to a Double.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:04:13] Well, this is a tough one because you really do have to choose between your short-term happiness and that of your wife here. And I can't make this decision for you. Nobody can, but you should ask yourself the following questions in my opinion. One, how tough is the financial situation? As a guy, and I was a provider, I feel like I'm always thinking about this and I've been as stressed about money. When I've been flat effing broke as when I've had huge amounts of money. And I think it's just my personality is wired that way. Not everyone is this way, but you have to sort of evaluate. Is it really dire straits financially, or could it be, or could it be really stressful? Or is this just you're saying, "Oh my gosh, I might have to work for extra years," or have you not even thought about this at all and it's just an emotional reaction. So that's kind of important. Because if it's, "Oh, I might not be able to retire at 55. I might have to work until, let me do the math, 58." I mean, that's kind of a different calculation or is this just cold sweats at night because kids are expensive. Can you make it or will this severely impact the quality of life for the whole family? That's the other question. Are you going from? "Sure. We can take the kids to Disneyland every year, just like we always wanted to do, and we can go to Hawaii and go surfing and everyone loves that." And then having another kid means, "Okay, everyone's going to a public school eating bread and water for lunch and no vacations ever again." You have to actually work that stuff out.

[00:05:39] Two, will your wife be disappointed both short term and long term if you don't have another child? Because you're happy short term without one, she's unhappy short term without one. Let's just paint that black and white. Of course, it's more nuanced, but she's also going to be sadder long term if you don't have a child. Are you going to be happy with that? Are you going to be okay with that? She might not indicate that she is upset. You know, she probably just won't get over that though if she's feeling that way now. You might want to have a heart to heart with her about that and if you need to go to a therapist once or twice for a session and have them sort of mediate this conversation. Mediate might not be the right word. Guide this conversation. Then I would suggest doing that. It's probably going to be a couple of hundred bucks for a couple of sessions and it might be really worth it to lay every card from both of you out on the table.

[00:06:25] Three, will you be disappointed both short term and long term if you can't move forward with your projects? Yes, having a kid now, you might have to table some stuff, but having a kid now might also mean that you can never right the good old American novel and take a bunch of time off every year. I don't really know what you're doing. But you might really be disappointed and you might say, well, I'm a little sad about how my life turned out, but I have three kids and they're amazing, so it all makes up for it. You really have to think about that. If there are career goals and things that you want to do, and you're really never going to be able to do them. Realistically not going to be able to do them, then that's something to consider. But if it's just kind of, "Man, I really like making woodworking projects in the garage and if we have another kid, well, it's going to be full of toys." I mean, you really have to make a list and write all this stuff down. I would consider journaling it. I'm not much of a write everything down, journaling kind of guy about my feelings, but this is kind of a pros and cons list to the power of two right, squared if you will. I think it's important to do that.

[00:07:27] This is something to consider carefully. Yeah, you could probably work on these projects later down the road, but you might be stressed financially for a long time, or maybe not. You've got two kids. Both are very young. Normally, I would suggest waiting to have another kid, but you're right, the window for this is very finite and is closing. And as for your wife's health, let her make this decision with you and her doctor. And be careful not to consciously or subconsciously use it as an excuse to advocate for what you want right now, which is stop having kids. You know you don't want to say, "Oh, but I'm worried about your health and worried about your health and worried about your health." And then in the back of your mind, you're like, "Well, I'm kind of worried about your health, but mostly I'm worried about my freedom." You really have to isolate each of the factors here and make sure that you're not secretly using that as an excuse to get what you want and to advocate what you want because that'll break a little bit of the trust. If she gets the idea that you're pretending or at least hamming it up a little about being concerned about her health and you're really more concerned about your freedom. If she gets a whiff of that, she's going to be pissed and she's going to trust you less. So you've got to examine that. Yes, give it weight as you should, but don't try to use it as a persuasion lever.

[00:08:39] I want to be clear here. There's nothing wrong with you wanting to move forward with projects and focus on yourself and your own goals, especially since you've already had two kids as planned as agreed. That said, you have to evaluate whether or not you're putting off your own happiness and projects for another couple of years, or if having another child will be a major financial hit and lifestyle downgrade for the foreseeable future. If so, how conscious is all this for both you and your wife? Or is it more of an emotional decision that may be for your wife because she wants a girl? Maybe she's thinking, but I really want to grow. And it's like, okay, but after you do the back of the napkin calculations, "Okay, but no way we can go on these vacations and no way can we get our summer home and no way are you able to quit your job." Like you've got to really lay this stuff out and get a grasp of all of the impact that this is going to have on your life. And if it's the latter, if it's an emotional decision because your wife really, really wants to grow, then lay that on the table so that you're not letting your emotions get the best of you at the expense of what's actually best for the whole family.

[00:09:44] And if she really wants a girl and she really means it, and she doesn't care about going to Disneyland because she really, really wants a girl and she really wants a third kid, well then I would say that that should weigh more than Disneyland, right? Because. I didn't go on a lot of vacations as a kid, but I was an only child. And if you had said, "Hey, you can go on 10 vacations a year as a kid, or you could have a sibling." I would choose a sibling personally. But again, I'm an only child. I'm not one of two. So all of these considerations need to be hashed out with your wife but actually, I would do it alone first. Then do it with your wife as well. That way your answers aren't colored by her desires, wishes, and everything. You can combine them later. In fact, you should both do it on your own and then come back and compare notes. Best of luck with this. I think this process will probably bring you closer to your wife, whether you decide to have another child or not.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:10:33] One other thing to really consider here though is if you go through all of this, you do have a third child. It's a boy. And she doesn't get a girl. How is that going to affect you long term and how's it going to affect her long term?

Jordan Harbinger: [00:10:43] Oh yeah. Interesting. She might end up with another boy and then is she going to be cool with that because you wanted another kid or is she going to be like, "Well let's have four kids." Right? Then, you got to figure out what's–

Jason DeFillippo: [00:10:52] Keep trying until you get one or what's the deal.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:10:55] Because if it's really she wants a girl, then you know, you can go and adopt a little girl and that would be quite a blessing for everyone involved.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:11:06] This is Feedback Friday. We'll be right back after this.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:11:10] This episode is sponsored in part by HostGator.

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Jordan Harbinger: [00:12:25] This episode is also sponsored by Brooklinen. So I slept on the Classic Percale. I hope I'm pronouncing that correctly. It's cool and crisp over the summer, and then I switched to the Luxe, which is buttery smooth for the wintertime. The bed bundle is a great deal and you can mix and match the colors on the size of the sheets, the duvet cover, the pillowcases because you spend a third of your life in the sheets. Don't you want to be insanely comfortable? So Brooklinen and they're delivering comfort all season long. They've got over 50,000 five-star reviews and counting. That's a crapload of sheets, people. Half a million happy sleepers. Brooklinen's mission is to make it comfortable luxury sheets, robes, loungewear, towels, and more without luxury markups. That's important because Brooklinen was the first direct to consumer bedding company. In other words, you skip the middle man kind of like we do with other things here on the show. Skip the middleman, save a little dough. Jason.

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[00:13:53] Thanks for listening and supporting the show. To learn more about our sponsors and get links to all the great discounts you just heard, visit jordanharbinger.com/deals. If you'd be so kind, please drop us a nice rating and review on iTunes or your podcast player of choice. It really helps us out and helps build the show family. If you want some tips on how to do that, head on over to jordanharbinger.com/subscribe. Now let's hear some more of your questions here on Feedback Friday.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:14:17] All right, next up.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:14:18] Hello J. Crew. The end of 2019 is upon us in the excitement of the new year is settling in. I work in a high-end restaurant and New Year's Eve is one of the two busiest days for us. The other being Valentine's day, it's always an all hands on deck situation. My older brother and his fiancée decided to have their wedding on this night. I received the news of this wonderful occasion in August and had been torn ever since. I put in a request for the night off as soon as I could. Not to my surprise, I was rejected. Bossman pulled me into his office and told me he would try to let me leave early, but by that time the ceremony would be long over and the reception would be ending shortly after I showed up. I can't help but feel like I'm letting my brother down for not being at a monumental event in his life, but I feel my presence at work is necessary on this big day. Please help and thank you. Signed, Wanting to be in Two Places at Once.

[00:15:08] Now, Jordan, is it me or is it a total dick move to get married on a holiday?

Jordan Harbinger: [00:15:12] Yeah. So I was going to make a note of that but decided not to. So I'm kind of glad that you did. I get it but man, it just causes all kinds of annoying little things like this. Granted, I don't know how many people who are doing that really care because it's like, "Well, it's our wedding."

Jason DeFillippo: [00:15:29] Yeah. My cousin got married in Pittsburgh on New Year's Eve. And I had to fly out from toasty warm California to go hang out with family on New Year's Eve in a really crappy hotel ballroom. Just because he decided to get married that night. Then I had to, of course, stay with family and do all that stuff, which was not in my plans for New Year's Eve that year. It turned it into misery is what it did, and I still haven't forgiven him for it.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:15:56] Well, it's almost like someone else's wedding isn't about you. I don't know.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:16:00] I don't know, man, but come on.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:16:02] The gall of some people

Jason DeFillippo: [00:16:03] Always about me. Jeez!

Jordan Harbinger: [00:16:05] I'm starting to get that feeling. Yeah. I think that there is something there, but I also get why people do it. Do you get to list the pros and cons of this here? I think we should just sort of go through this, right? If you stay at work. You keep your job, that's kind of the most obvious pro. You probably make a bunch of cash because it's your industry. Your boss isn't mad at you and all that. The con of not going to your brother's wedding. Do we even need to list those out? Family is going to be annoyed. Brother's going to be annoyed. We'll get to those later. Pro of going to your brother's wedding memories to last a lifetime. Not pissing off your whole family, I think is probably a decent one. I'm not good at pros and cons lists, but let's just say, let's just throw those out there. Now, I understand both perspectives here, especially owning a business myself, and that said. This is your brother, and it's his wedding. Jobs come and go, especially these days. And family hopefully does not come and go. And I hate letting people down as much as the next guy, but if I had to choose between my boss at a restaurant and my entire family. I know what I would choose and I get it. This is a huge night for the restaurant and it will cause problems if you're not there.

[00:17:14] I would strongly consider finding other ways to help that night if possible, and also make sure that you understand that going to the wedding might entail you finding another job as well, because I think it's very possible that after you request time off and your bosses know, and then you say, "Guess what, it's my brother's wedding. I'm going." They might let you go. And I hate that you have to make that choice. And normally I'd say talk to your brother, but here's the thing, if he's a good brother, not that he would move the wedding, but just those that he would understand. But the problem is here if he's a good brother, he's just going to say, "Oh no, go to work. I understand. I get it, man. Try and show up later for the reception. We'll have a drink together." But that's not really what he means. What he means is, "Damn, that's really disappointing and I wish you could be there. And. That really sucks that you had to choose work over me. I guess you really need the money," but he's going to be a good brother and not say that. So your brother will miss you at the wedding. Your parents will miss you at the wedding. The bride's parents will miss you at the wedding. All the friends, all the groomsmen, all the bridesmaids. Everyone's going to miss you at the wedding and you're going to be bummed that you missed the wedding. You're going to be looking at photos and videos of something that should be one of the most joyous occasions in your entire family, short of childbirth.

[00:18:21] So I'm a little biased. I had a lot of fun at my wedding. I didn't invite that many people because I thought, oh, it's going to be inconvenient for them. They're going to have to fly across the country. They have kids. I barely invited anyone to the ceremony. Jason, you were there. I mean, you saw it. It was pretty small, and most of them were like Jen's mom's friends.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:18:38] No, it was a great ceremony. It's nice and small. Actually, that was one of the best parts

Jordan Harbinger: [00:18:41] It was, it was really nice. But if I'd had a brother, I mean my host brother flew in from Germany. Actually, he flew in from Thailand and my host father, when I was an exchange and I lived in Germany, he flew in from Germany for this and it was kind of a big deal. I would be really annoyed if an actual blood brother didn't show up. I would have been annoyed if Florian didn't show up from Thailand.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:19:02] Yup. You are going to create so much animosity in the family and it's going to be something that lives with you for the rest of your life.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:19:08] It is.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:19:08] I mean, that's why I went to my cousin's wedding. It's like you got to be there. You got to show up for these major milestone events. Jobs come and go, you know you're going to be working the rest of your life. It might not be at the same restaurant and it's a restaurant anyway. You know you're going to leave eventually. So, you know, in my book, me personally, I would have it out with the boss man one more time and just say, "Look, this is a non-starter for me. I'm going to my brother's wedding. Is there something I can do to help make it easy for him? Like you said, Jordan

Jordan Harbinger: [00:19:35] Work all night, chopping vegetables with the prep team, like whatever you know can be done. And I know that, that's not when they need them, but here's the thing. Let's say he worked for space X. And they were going to launch a satellite that day and they needed him because he was a key person in that. Then I would say this is a different situation, but real talk. It's a restaurant. He's not the GM. He's a server or something in the restaurant. I don't even think he's in the kitchen. So, it's not like the place can't open and do business. I had a buddy who, his brother was getting married in Turkey because they're Turkish and he was a major developer at Apple on iOS. I won't mention who it is because, you know, not cool. And he told them a year or two in advance, "I'm going to my brother's wedding. It's in Turkey, it's on this date." And then two or three weeks or months, whatever it was before, they were like, we really need you here. We're launching a new version of the iOS system and he said, "No." And they were like, "Well, this could be a problem for you." And he goes, "I don't care. It's my brother's wedding. If you want me to resign before that, then let me know." And they were like, "Oh, have fun." No problems. Didn't need them at all, did a couple of hours of work from Turkey, not a big deal. I realized you can't serve dinner from the reception from your phone, so it's a little different, but I get it. I would lay down the law. I just don't think that this is going to make sense. I think you're going to be super upset and your family's going to be upset and it's just not worth it. And go enjoy the wedding instead of thinking about how you got fired for going. That's my last recommendation.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:21:11] Enjoy that. Free champagne.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:21:13] That's right. Next up.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:21:14] Hi, Jordan and Jason. you guys have had great advice for these kinds of tricky family situations in the past, so here it goes. I had a $60,000 college fund allocated to me from an insurance settlement from a childhood car accident. When I enrolled in university, I was surprised to learn that my mother had spent it all. Hence, she took out a $40,000 parent loan and I took out what total to be $160,000 in student loans to cover undergrad and grad school. After getting my career off to a great start and living frugally, I paid off my student loans by age 30. Though I very much appreciate my mother's support. I was frustrated when my mother told family and friends that she solely put me through college as a single mother, given the hard work of my 20s I was disappointed to find out recently that she hadn't been making payments at all on that parent loan, and it had accrued an additional $28,000 in interest due to nonpayment. Now married, I made the decision with my husband to pay off the principal of that loan as it ultimately was for my education. While we make a good living. This was a financial setback for us. Now we're stuck on the accrued interest. He believes we should not take on the consequences of my mother's irresponsibility. I, honestly, agree with him, but I feel stuck because I know my mother won't pay it and this will cause problems in the family. How would you approach this? Signed, Another Stuck Daughter and Wife. And a note, the loan is in her name, not ours.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:22:35] Wow. Yikes. Okay, so it depends on what you want to happen here. Yes, you can. This is one of those times where I have to say, I'm a lawyer, but I'm not your lawyer. Before you do anything drastic, I would always get legal counsel and most lawyers will be able to tell you in a few minutes. They might not even charge you for this. Yes, you can in theory, get a lawyer, et cetera. Stop paying off the parent loan and then it falls on your mother. She will suffer the financial consequences of that and not you. The one thing I would say to make sure of here is just to make sure that there's no sort of liability or waiver of any rights considering you paid off the balance of the loans. Sometimes people can argue, "Oh, well they accepted responsibility for this, dah, dah, dah, dah," but if on paper it's still in her name and you're just giving her the money or mailing in a check. Often she's still responsible. Just make damn sure, depending on what you do. She'll suffer the financial consequences of that and not you. Of course, this will damage your relationship with your mother and potentially with other people in the family. I wouldn't imagine siblings, aunts, and uncles, they won't take too kindly to, and then I stuffed mom with that loan and now she lives in a homeless shelter. They're not going to like that. Or she lives in grandma's basement.

[00:23:44] Alternately, you can keep paying the loan, which is a bummer because it sets you back financially, even though it wasn't really for your education, but it was a loan your mother took out to support the family when you were younger as a single mom. So I mean, there's something to be said for that. I can't tell you what to do here, but what I can say is that having a kid. I cannot imagine raising a kid as a single parent. It sounds like you and your mother have some fundamental disagreements about who put you through school or who put who through school. I get that. It would be annoying to hear, "I put them through college on my own." When you worked your butt off, you're unlikely to resolve those issues and you probably really don't need to. Look, who cares if your mom says that she put you through school? Yeah. You worked really hard. I don't think she's trying to cheap in that. I think she's just trying to communicate that she also worked really hard to raise you and you went through college, you know, nobody was helping her out.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:24:37] Yeah. But the mother also stole $60,000 of her college fund.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:24:41] Yeah. I mean, she took a loan, but she probably didn't buy a boat with it like that other a-holes parents did. She was probably trying to put food on the table.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:24:49] Well, yeah, the $40,000 parent loan went to her schooling, but there was the $60,000 college fund that the daughter had. That the mother basically took before she even got to college.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:24:59] Am I misunderstanding this? She took $40,000 of --

Jason DeFillippo: [00:25:04] She took $60,000 of a settlement that the daughter got, which was basically put aside for her college and spent that money before the daughter got to school. So to help out, she took a $40,000 loan to help with the schooling and didn't pay that back. So, there's still a $60,000 hole in this story that's not being accounted for.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:25:24] Okay. So I totally understood this differently, and now I'm not sure what's correct here. I understood that she got the $60,000 college fund, or sorry, the settlement from the insurance company, and then the mother took out a $40,000 parent loan against that college fund.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:25:41] Nope. The mother had spent all the money, the $60,000 was spent by the mother by the time the daughter got to college.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:25:47] And then she took out a $40,000 parent loan also.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:25:51] To pay for school, yeah. So that was like her make good. And then the daughter still had to pay back the $40,000 parent loans. So she's paid $200,000 in student loans so far. There's $28,000 outstanding in interest and penalties, and that first $60,000 has vanished into the ether. So the daughter here is literally out $260,000 and the mother hasn't put in a cent.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:26:14] Yuck, okay. All right. I misunderstood that, but I'm not totally sure that it changes my answer because I still think stuffing your mom with the debt, even if she quote-unquote deserves it and your opinion is still going to piss off your mom and the rest of the family. I don't think other people are going to understand that. I also stand by my statement that raising a kid as a single parent would be a living nightmare in so many ways. I also don't think it matters if your mom says she put you through school. I don't see it as malicious. Her saying that maybe it is the way she says it. I'm not there when she does. It sounds like she's still raised. You still paid for everything. Yes, you worked very hard to get through school and unless you think she's trying to embarrass you or cheapen that somehow, and honestly, even if she is, who cares? I would honestly recommend letting it go.

[00:26:58] As for the loan amounts, you can choose between one paying it off, which is a huge burden for you and will breed resentment towards your mom, obviously from you. Two, letting your mom pay it off or just letting it go to collections, which will breed resentment towards you from your mom and possibly the rest of the family. Or three, come to some sort of agreement with your mother. Can she pay off part of the interest? Maybe you can split it. Maybe you can find some other way to knock out the debt. I don't know. At the end of the day, if you have a good relationship with your mother, you shouldn't risk that relationship because of who's right about paying for college or about money. I just wouldn't do it. That said, you should also not swallow a massive financial burden just to avoid a conflict. Maybe there's a way you can do this. Maybe if you know, like, look, Jason, if mom owns the house that she lives in, then the writer here pays off. There's alone and is able to then sell the house and sort of make it up later. It might not be all the debt, but it's a trade that maybe doesn't make everyone feel horrible. I think the best way to navigate this is to lay your cards on the table and figure out what the combined forces of you and your mother can do to mitigate the financial burden. In a perfect world, she'd handle this debt, but in a perfect world, she probably wouldn't have chosen to raise kids on her own without any help.

[00:28:12] From the sound of this letter, it sounds like you've got a great head on your shoulders and congrats on that. I know we're talking about a lot of money, but any problem that can be solved with money is not that big of a problem over time. The key is to keep money problems as money problems and not turn money problems into emotional or family problems. And I think that's kind of important. I don't have complete information here, so that's my two cents based on what you've given me and I clearly misunderstood initially. I know this is not an easy one. So best of luck and let us know how this shakes out.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:28:42] I think they should also, if they can combine forces, the mother and the daughter also find like a financial planner who can actually try and talk to the loan holder and maybe cut down some of that debt. Like if they agree to a payment plan, they might be willing to shave off a chunk of that debt. Since it is basically just the interest in penalties, so it's not the principal. The principal has been paid back, so they might be a little bit more lenient on paying off that interest.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:29:06] Yeah, that's a good point. I hadn't thought about that, but you're right, there might be something that can be done there as well.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:29:13] We'll be right back with more Feedback Friday right after this.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:29:16] This episode is sponsored in part by Better Help. I know you think you probably don't need therapy, but let's be real. The holidays are coming up and your family members need therapy and they're not going to get it, so you probably should. Better Help will help you with depression, stress, anxiety, relationship, sleeping, trauma, anger, family conflict, grief, self-esteem, and frankly, who doesn't have literally all of those happening over the holidays. You can connect with your professional counselor in a safe and private online environment. Obviously, everything's confidential, but mostly it's convenient here. You can do it from your car or you can walk out to your garage or go in the basement or hell, go in the backyard with a freaking set of gloves on and a hat while your family's in the house and talk to your therapist because some of you, frankly, myself included, might need to go ahead and do that. Everything's secure -- phone, chat, text with your therapist. You could get therapy while you're in the room with your family by using text. That's how convenient this actually is, and frankly important. Jason, tell him where to get it.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:30:14] It's a truly affordable option and our listeners get 10% off your first month with a discount code JORDAN. Why not get started today? Go to betterhelp.com/jordan. Simply fill out a questionnaire to help them assess your needs and get matched with a counselor you'll love. That's betterhelp.com/jordan.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:30:31] This episode is also sponsored by Native Deodorant. Native creates safe, simple, and effective products that people use in the bathroom every single day. If you're not convinced they've got over 8,000 five-star reviews. The idea here is trusted ingredients and trusted performance formulated without aluminum. There are no parabens, there's no talc, which by the way can contain asbestos. That's the big deal about talc. It's filled with ingredients found in nature, such as coconut oil which is antimicrobial, shea butter which is a moisturizer and emollients, and tapioca starch which sounds delicious, but mostly absorbs wetness in the case of deodorant. No animal testing, free shipping, free returns. And you know, the stuff works. Everybody who's gotten this from the show here loves it. It smells good. It smells natural. Aluminum-free, safe, effective, can't really beat that. For 20 percent off your first purchase, visit nativedeodorant.com and use promo code J-H-S. That's nativedeodorant.com. The promo code for us this time is a little different. It's J-H-S. use that during checkout and get 20% off and let me know which I'd say flavor, but I really mean scent, but I also kind of really mean flavor because this stuff makes you want to eat it. nativedeodorant.com use promo code J-H-S at checkout.

[00:31:44] This episode is also sponsored in part by Skillshare. Loving some Skillshare. Jason, I know you're doing a Final Cut Pro course. How's that going?

Jason DeFillippo: [00:31:52] It's going really well. I've actually learned how to draw on my iPad and make it part of my videos now. That was my latest course,

Jordan Harbinger: [00:31:58] So you can just take the pencil, draw something on the iPad and throw it into the video using Final Cut.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:32:03] Yup. Pretty straightforward. Yeah, it's pretty neat. You used to think, oh my god, that has to be some like super expensive system. Nope. You just basically draw in your note app and he tells you how to take it. Flip the colors around and make it look like you're drawing right there on the screen. It's pretty cool.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:32:17] Oh, so you can actually draw and it shows you drawing it. It doesn't just show the image.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:32:21] Right? You do like real-time drawing, paste it into your video and it looks like you're literally drawing on the screen. Like, you know, the old football plays where they would circle the guys.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:32:29] Yeah. I was just going to say like football where John men, like "You go to the cornerback over here and you just drive it through the line." Yeah. That kind of thing. I loved that thing. That's the only reason I watched football when I was little because I was like, that looks like magic. That's straight-up magic right there.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:32:43] Now you can do it with Skillshare.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:32:45] Which is an online learning community for the creator and all of us. They've got thousands of classes, photography, creative writing, design, productivity, Final Cut Pro, iPad drawing class. You can get inspired, join a class, create something you'll love, and this isn't all you can eat type situation. Right, Jason? You don't buy the classes in there. You get everything.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:33:03] You get everything on Skillshare, and also the classes get updated when the technology updates. Unlike those free videos that you see on YouTube.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:33:11] Yeah. The ones where somebody is like, "Here's version two," and you're like, "Look, this is from 2014." The button's not where it was supposed to be and that feature's gone and now people have these now. That's always been frustrating with the free stuff. I do like Skillshare for that reason, especially when I'm learning something technical. Jason, where can they get a deal on Skillshare?

Jason DeFillippo: [00:33:30] They can join the millions of students already learning on Skillshare and get two months free when you sign up at skillshare.com/harbinger. That's two whole months of unlimited access to thousands of classes for free. Get started today by heading to skillshare.com/harbinger to sign up. That's skillshare.com/harbinger.

[00:33:49] Thank you for supporting the show. Your support of our advertisers helps keep us on the air. To learn more and get links to all the great discounts you just heard, visit jordanharbinger.com/deals. Now back to the show for the conclusion of Feedback Friday.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:34:04] All right. What's next?

Jason DeFillippo: [00:34:05] Hey, Jordan and Jason. I make my own hours at work. I write my time in and my time out every day today. I showed up, put my time in, started working, sat down for a minute and just straight up, fell asleep for about an hour. Is it wrong or unprofessional to not change my timesheet around now? Is it really stealing? I love my job. No one would ever have any way of knowing what I did for that hour. Plus, I'll still get everything done and more. It's a job where I have to look for things to do. What do you think? Thanks, Asleep on the Job.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:34:35] Well, whenever stuff like this comes up, the question to ask is how would you feel if you put yourself in your boss's position. I think anyone can understand falling asleep for an hour, even in the office, especially if you're already a high performer. Yes, you could lie and get away with it. You could even clock out an hour early and then keep working for an hour to make it up. But look at this as a way to build trust with the company potentially. In other words, if you edit the timesheet and they say, "Oh, why did you edit the timesheet. You can say, well, I had to step out and take care of something. So I wanted to make sure that I clocked out for that hour. I didn't do it before." Since almost no one does this. That builds trust and credibility in the eyes of whoever's managing the timesheet. You can even say, I wasn't feeling well and I just rested during that hour and I don't think I should get paid for it. That will build trust and credibility in the eyes of whoever manages the timesheet. Imagine having a reputation at work as somebody who is honest, no matter what, even if they would never get caught for something, that's a pretty good reputation to have and it's the type of person that gets promoted.

[00:35:39] And if you're on salary, but for some reason clock in and out that I would say don't worry about it as much because then you're just changing an entry in a spreadsheet that probably has no bearing on anything. But if you're hourly, then edit the timesheet and just be honest, you'll feel better about it. It's the right thing to do. And also, Jason, I don't know about this. This is speculation, but if I'm an employer and I'm looking at work that's gotten completed or done, I would probably say, all right, how long did it take this person to complete this job? And I would look to promote the people that are able to finish the most work quickly because they're technically worth more money than somebody who takes more time to do the same amount of work.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:36:16] Correct.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:36:16] You don't know if they're monitoring this, so you might actually be hurting yourself by letting that hour average into your productivity.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:36:23] Very good point. Very good point. Yeah. I think the one thing that you said that is really good, just you know. Tell them, get it fixed and you're going to look like somebody who cares. Honestly, that's really what it comes down to. It's like, I'm not trying to build the company. This is what happened. No big deal, but I wanted to bring it to your attention, and the only thing that comes out of this is good. Yeah, you lose an hour's pay, but Hey, you got a nap in the process, so do the right thing.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:36:47] All right, Jason, what's next?

Jason DeFillippo: [00:36:49] Jordan, I'm 32 years old and I'm retiring from a 10-year professional athletic career. I've saved a solid chunk of change and have the luxury to take some time to navigate my next career move. I have a BA in Economics, but I'm unsure what I really want to do next. I've been contemplating the idea of going back to school. What are your thoughts on higher education degrees versus real job experience? Also, if you were in my position, what would be your game plan to most effectively execute a career change and figure out what career will best fit my future? Thanks for your advice. Athlete on the Move.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:37:22] There's a joke among law students and lawyers that if any of us would have worked in a law office for a summer before applying to law school, the place would be empty. I remember hearing that quite a bit from people and then, of course, one person in the corner would be like, "I worked at a law office," and we're like, "Oh, that makes sense." That's, yes, that makes sense. You were born to be a lawyer. You're the one person in the room. That definitely should be in this profession. You know, no disrespect intended. They were the type of person that we all kind of secretly wished we were conscientious, had the ambition to be a lawyer, have had a passion for the law. We're all like, "Oh, I don't have that. Should I be here?" And the answer is no. Many jobs, especially those with large companies, they require college degrees. Of course, most companies don't say which degree because they actually don't care like at all. As you're probably well aware, most degrees, especially undergraduate degrees, they don't really qualify you in the technical sense for pretty much anything with the exception of trades, of course, engineering, architecture, things like that.

[00:38:25] Since you've already got a BA in Economics, you're pretty much qualified for any job that's not a trade, law, medicine, engineering, all that stuff. So no, I would not go back to school unless you are specifically aiming at a trade or a job that requires that degree for a darn good reason. Don't just believe what you see here on the web. You'll know it's required by working at the company first and speaking to the people that matter. Don't look at what's on the website. Don't listen to what some random intern in the HR department says on the phone and is reading off of the so-called requirements list for a position. Things are flexible when they find the right person without you having spent four years getting a degree in whatever so that you're technically qualified. They can waive all that stuff. Since you've already proven on paper that you can get a degree from a four-year institution, I'd say you don't need another one barring special circumstances. Job experience rules the day.

[00:39:20] I would strongly consider getting some entry-level jobs in the fields that you're exploring. It doesn't have to be entry-level. You don't have to become a bank teller or something like that in order to work at a bank and corporate. I just mean start working in corporate even if you think, "Oh, but I want to do this other thing." Just get your foot in the door in the same area that you want to work and that will give you some great insight into what you want to do with your life and the real work behind it. A lot of people think that a field is one way when really the whole day-to-day is completely different. That's the insight that you want to get. And yeah, the pay might be lower because you're just getting your feet wet somewhere, but you can see what it's really like working for a specific company or industry. And if you find that you're running into walls with some more traditional companies, you might try the tech sector as many of those companies are a bit more forward-thinking and respect different types of experience, I would say a bit more so than some of the stodgy behemoths might do. So they might say, "Wow, you spent 10 years as a pro athlete, you would be a great fit for our sales department. Do you think you can go out and meet clients and be charming and get them to buy our software as a service product?" That might be the kind of thing you're really good at because you're used to being competitive, working with other people, team mentality, that kind of stuff. Getting up early, putting the reps in that might be a better qualification than somebody who's got a degree in XYZ, and two years of experience selling widgets.

[00:40:43] Since you've got the luxury of time, I would make a list of the type of things that interest you and do some informational interviews in those industries. So you're going to want to network, make inroads, make connections, find people in the companies, do phone calls or ideally meet with them in person and ask about the situation on the ground. Find out what they do day-to-day. A lot of people might even be interested in your pro athletics background. So they might say, "Yeah, sure, come to the office and we'll do coffee. And I'll tell you what, it's really like working in the accounts receivable department here at Dropbox," whatever it is. A lot of people will be surprisingly open to meet you and then apply for positions based on your experience and their experience as conveyed to you during these informational interviews. There are different ways to go about this, but I would say the least effective, the least efficient way by far is to go back to school for four more years. If you do that, you'll come out in three or four years, you'll be right back where you started, but tens of thousands of dollars lighter in the wallet for having done so. Okay. What's next?

Jason DeFillippo: [00:41:44] Hey, many Js. A friend of mine has been publishing articles about stuff he cares about with the aims of raising his profile at work and identifying a sideline business. So far so good. The issue is that he can be careless with spelling, punctuation, and grammatical style and really needs to get on top of his editing. His latest work is riddled with such errors, and I feel they take away from the professional finish he's aiming for. He asked me to look it over to check if anything was missing from the content. And what I couldn't find fault with that. The mistakes graded on me. Rather than give him a laundry list of fixes, I pointed out the more glaring errors, such as some blatantly incorrect apostrophes and a misspelled name. How do I tactfully suggest that he needs an editor? I could do it, but I worry that I might alter the tone from his voice to my own since it's not my area of expertise. Kind regards, The Non-editor.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:42:35] Well, I would go with a little radical candor here from the Kim Scott episode of the show. I think he is going to want to hear what you have to say. Also, if you ever listen to Sam Harris, he wrote a book on lying and about why you should literally never do it. I would put yourself in his shoes. Be polite about it, of course. You don't have to be insulting or anything, but right now, think about this. He's doing negative advertising right now. You might need to show him this. "Hey, I want to get a side hustle. So I'm doing a little personal branding." "Yes, this is negative branding. It's actually contrary to the reason that you're doing this at all. If I were looking to hire somebody and I was thinking, Oh, who knows a lot about XYZ topic, and there was one person that I met and they seem to know a lot during the interview, but they hadn't written anything or done anything online. And then there was another person that seemed to know a lot about the topic and they'd written a bunch of stuff online, but it all had grammar and spelling errors in it. I probably would actually choose the person that hadn't done the extra work in the writing, but I would ask for a writing sample from him as well because I don't want somebody like that who's not detail-oriented working for me in the company. It's embarrassing. It's also bad branding for the company and the fact that he doesn't realize it. Look, if you find a typo in an article, not a big deal. If you find 17 typos in every article, that's a problem. It shows lack of attention to detail. It shows that they're cool having negative branding attached to them and they don't even notice they're oblivious. That's really, really bad. That's worse than nothing at all.

[00:44:03] He's going to appreciate you for this. When you explain it clearly. Look, he can hire someone on Fiverr or TaskRabbit or wherever these websites are to do proofreading. They can do it from the UK or the middle of America or the frigging Philippines if they're an English teacher or something like that. They can do it on the cheap if needed. Don't volunteer to do it for him because this is a job that takes time. You don't want the extra work and responsibility, especially since, like you said, it might alter the tone of what he's writing and it's going to mess with your friendship. Why is this your responsibility? You're already doing plenty of work pointing this out to him in the first place. If he wants to do this, he should hire a proofreader. It's probably going to cost him 30 bucks an article and it's completely worth it.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:44:44] You know what he could also do is just sign up for a Grammarly account.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:44:47] What's that?

Jason DeFillippo: [00:44:47] You've never heard of Grammarly?

Jordan Harbinger: [00:44:49] No.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:44:50] Oh, it is AI grammar correction. So it will find those apostrophes. It will find those commas and offer suggestions to make your writing better.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:44:58] Wow. That's really cool.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:44:59] Yeah. If you don't want to actually ask him about -- you know, "Hey, maybe sign up for some Grammarly stuff," maybe you could just get his email and sign him up for some newsletters. Just do it on the, on the sly, on the back end.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:45:11] That's really interesting. I actually had no idea that that existed, so yeah, he could hire someone to do that and then just have somebody else do a quick sanity check. The thing is, if you're not using a spellchecker, I'm really suspicious of you at that point. What program are you even writing in that doesn't tell you, "Hey, this is a misspelled word." Even Apple Notes on your phone will tell you if you have a misspelled word. I don't think it'll do grammar, but it will at least tell you that you spelled something wrong. I'm almost like impressed in the wrong way, but where he's writing something --

Jason DeFillippo: [00:45:45] Maybe to get if fast.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:45:47] Yeah. Where are you writing something that doesn't have a spellcheck? I'm trying to even think what app would have that.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:45:52] It's got like Word on an old version of XP in the corner.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:45:55] I know. I mean, even my text messages spellcheck these days,

Jason DeFillippo: [00:45:59] Maybe he's writing it longhand on a piece of paper and then OCR-ing it, and it just keeps everything.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:46:04] I'm just shocked. Yeah. Maybe he's writing on a napkin and then, yes, scanning it.

[00:46:08] Life Pro Tip. I love this app for Mac. It's called Bartender. It can be janky sometimes, but what it does is, you know those little icons on the menu bar next to the clock, Jason. You get like 50 of those over time they start adding up. They start crowding into the menus on your laptop or on your computer screen.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:46:25] Oh yeah. I use iStat menu, which you can just overload the entire menu bar with all the stats about your computer, so I know exactly what you're talking about.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:46:33] Yeah, I've got that too. I love iStat menu, but yeah, it adds like, Oh, your upload and download. Oh, how full is my hard drive? The weather outside, all that stuff.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:46:41] Yeah, Pretty much everything. What's your dog feeling like today?

Jordan Harbinger: [00:46:43] Exactly. Yeah, so I have a zillion icons and I'm like, "Oh, I only want to see those occasionally." So I use Bartender and it hides things in as sub-menu. It's actually super, super helpful. Also, I got this app for Mac called Endurance and it was 20 bucks. There's a trial, of course, it's called Endurance, and what it does is when you're on battery power, you can click power save mode. Yes, it will dim the screen. You can able to disable that, but it will also pause background apps that might be checking for email or using the internet or doing some other sort of background process to make the app faster so it slows down the computer. But if you're just surfing the web reading, if you're just watching a movie in the foreground, but all these other apps are in the background, or if you're checking your email and writing email, it can add like 15 to 20 percent of battery life depending on your battery, your laptop, that condition to the battery. It's really, really nice. Jason, I know you use, we both use FruitJuice.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:47:37] Yeah, FruitJuice is fantastic because it keeps your battery conditioned over time. It will tell you how much time every day you need to unplug because if you're one of those people that just keep your laptop plugged in to a monitor and a keyboard all day, you're basically just killing your battery by just putting in juice all the time. FruitJuice will just let you know like, okay, today you need to unplug it for 20 minutes. Then the next day, okay, maybe 30 minutes to this day or 10 minutes this day. And then every 30 days you run a maintenance cycle where you drain it down and then bring it back up and it really helps the battery life extend on your laptops because I'm running 2014 MacBook Pros and I did have to replace the battery in one of them, but I did get a lot longer life out of it than I would if I wasn't using FruitJuice. And I think bartender, fantastic app suggestion. I love it. You're the one that originally turned me on to it a couple of years ago and it's on all my machines. Endurance is a new one and now that I've got a little, a MacBook air, I could definitely use it cause I think drains pretty quick, surprisingly, even though they say it'll last forever. So I'm looking forward to that when and then FruitJuice. So you've got the trifecta there of great little apps.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:48:41] Yeah. I thought I would share these, because people are always like, "Oh, what's that? What's that do?" And then they try it and they're like, "This is amazing. How do more people not know about this?" And. So yeah, you're welcome. FruitJuice, Bartender, Endurance. We'll link to all those in the show notes

Jason DeFillippo: [00:48:53] And we both mentioned iStat menus, which is also a fantastic app that if you want to have another one that's running up there, but it will tell you your CPU, your network traffic. And the one that I really like is if you're on a laptop, it shows you your sensors and how hot your computer is getting. And you can even turn the fan up high in the menus if you don't mind the noise to cool it down. So if it's on your lap and it's getting really hot, you can just junk up the fan and cool it down quite a bit, so it's not as uncomfortable for like long writing sessions on your lap.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:49:22] Ah, that's interesting. I did not actually know about that. I never used that.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:49:26] Yeah, that's a fantastic one. You can see all of the sensors, it's an information overload and it's just also fun to see how much like data that your computer is actually giving you that you never even saw it before.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:49:37] Recommendation of the week. Broken. I loved this. This is on Netflix, it's called Broken. Counterfeit makeup is a bigger business than cocaine. Go figure.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:49:46] What?

Jordan Harbinger: [00:49:47] I know vaping and addicted teens, big tobacco caching into that furniture killing people and how it contributes to illegal logging and national parks and Eastern Europe and how recycling is kind of a sham in a lot of ways. In fact, experts are starting to call what we're doing wishcycling because people throw everything in the recycle bin. It's like, "Hey, one percent of that is recyclable. Everything else just goes to a landfill in Malaysia." It's just really, really bad. But I loved this series Broken on Netflix. It's a four-part series, so interesting.

[00:50:18] So interesting. I hope you all enjoyed that. I want to thank everyone that wrote in this week. If you want to go to prison with us, February 26, 2020. It's going to be a great time. Email me at prison@jordanharbinger.com. We'll get you in there. A link to the show notes for this episode can be found at jordanharbinger.com.

[00:50:34] Quick shout out to Melissa Kellogg and John Bjork. That must be a confusing name for people Bjork.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:50:41] How many people do you think ask if they're related, not knowing that -- ?

Jordan Harbinger: [00:50:44] It has to be tons, tons of people have to do that. Thanks for writing in suggestions of what to call the listeners. I'm still taking suggestions. What should we call you that people are like The Binger, The J Crew? I don't know. I'm not in love with any of these yet. I'm still open to ideas. Maybe something will grow on me. I don't know. Feel free to shoot me an email at jordan@jordanharbinger.com. Go back and check out the guest from this week, Doug Williams, about the polygraph. The lie detector is a lie if you haven't heard that yet.

[00:51:12] If you want to know how I managed to book all these. Interesting, unique, amazing people and manage my relationships. I use systems. I use tiny habits. It's just a few minutes a day. jordanharbinger.com/course. That course, again, is free. It's just a few minutes a day. It will change the game, the way you network. It's not fluff. It's crucial. It's been great for the business as well. jordanharbinger.com/course. I'm also on Instagram and Twitter at @JordanHarbinger. That's a great way to get a hold of me. Videos of our interviews are at jordanharbinger.com/youtube as well.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:51:42] and you can check out my tech podcast, Grumpy Old Geeks. We discuss what went wrong on the internet and who's to blame along with cybersecurity, apps, gadgets, books, movies, and more. That's Grumpy Old Geeks, and we just actually published episode 400. We're not going anywhere anytime soon, so feel free to check that one out.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:52:00] This show was created in association with PodcastOne and the episode was produced by Jen Harbinger, edited by Jase Sanderson, show notes for the episode by Robert Fogarty, music by Evan Viola. Keeps sending in your questions to friday@jordanharbinger.com. Our advice and opinions, and those of our guests are their own. And yes, I'm a lawyer, but not your lawyer, so do your own research before implementing anything you hear on the show. And remember, we rise by lifting others. Share the show with those you love, and even those you don't. Lots more in the pipe. Very excited for 2020. In the meantime, do your best to apply what you hear on the show so you can live what you listen and we'll see you next time.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:52:37] We're deep into this year's NFL season and everyone wants to know who will be coming out on top. Am I right? Well, then you need to check out the one podcast that can get you everything you need to know about the biggest NFL games and analysis on the postseason. I'm talking about the Ross Tucker Football Podcast. Ross played seven years in the NFL before retiring, so you know, he's got the insight or knowledge you crave. Be sure to check out the Ross Tucker Football Podcast every week on PodcastOne Apple Podcasts, and many of your favorite podcast listening apps.