1093: When the Hunter Becomes the Honeypot | Feedback Friday

1093: When the Hunter Becomes the Honeypot | Feedback Friday

This transcript is yet untouched by human hands. Please proceed with caution as we sort through what the robots have given us. We appreciate your patience!

[00:00:00] Jordan Harbinger: Welcome to Feedback Friday. I'm your host, Jordan Harbinger. As always, I'm here with Feedback Friday producer, the red-nosed reindeer, pulling the sleigh of conundrum as we drop these fire gifs of life drama beneath your tree, Gabriel Mizrahi. Ho ho. Hold up. I guess. Yeah, hold up.

That's right. When it's not gonna be socks that I can promise you, you're not gonna end up with socks or underwear. No, these stalking stuffers are gonna be lit today. Lit. Just trauma in there. That's all. Just pure unadulterated

[00:00:35] Gabriel Mizrahi: Trauma. What is this? What'd you get me this year? Oh, a whole new batch of WTF.

Thanks, mom. Yeah.

[00:00:40] Jordan Harbinger: exactly. On The Jordan Harbinger Show, we decode the stories, secrets, and skills of the world's most fascinating people and turn their wisdom into practical advice that you can use to impact your own life and those around you. Our mission on the show is to help you become a better informed, more critical thinker.

During the week, we have long form conversations with a variety of amazing folks from former jihadi and drug traffickers to generals and rocket scientists, even the occasional extreme athlete or tech luminary. This week we had Gene Simmons lead singer of kiss, former formerly lead singer of KISS on fame, money parenting, kind of maybe a case study on some things, what not to do in life in many ways, even though he's extremely successful by certain metrics.

We also had a skeptical Sunday, last Sunday on troubled teens On Fridays, though we share stories, take listener letters, offer advice, and get weirdly vulnerable because I'm gonna get real TMI today and share with all of you that I got a vasectomy this week. You sure did. And I am in pain right now. Yeah.

So for guys out there, it's like I got kicked in the balls every hour for the last five days. It may be not that bad, but it's like definitely feels like a serious kick in the nuts maybe every morning. 'cause when you lay down, you're fine. So that's the thing is that every day I go to sleep and I'm like, oh, I'm gonna be good.

I wake up, I'm like, I'm cured. And then three hours later I'm like, Nope, not at all. However, I will say that I, I'm excited for the results, I guess you would say. So for the game nerds out there, myself included, it's like, you know when you pick up a new weapon in a game and you're like, oh, I can't wait to fire this thing and see what it's like.

That's kind of, that's kind of where I'm at with it. Although right now it's kind of like getting stabbed, even thinking about doing that. So I gotta wait a couple weeks. Your health bar is low and it's slowly working its way back up. Mm-hmm. That's right. And it's every time you fire it, that health bar takes a little bit of a ding.

I would imagine. So. You gotta be careful, but you know, ouch. There's gonna be a vast deference between the hanky panky I had before and the hanky panky I'm having now. You know what I mean? That was solid fun. I like that one. You can't get a vasectomy without locking in a couple vast deference jokes.

[00:02:43] Clip Filler: No.

[00:02:43] Jordan Harbinger: What kind of father would I be if I didn't take advantage of this particular opportunity? That will never arise again? I. Speaking of a rising, uh, that also is painful. Who's gonna say it? I don't know. Um, as always, as always, we've got some fun ones and some doozies. Excited to dive in. Gabe, what's the

[00:03:04] Gabriel Mizrahi: first thing out of the mailbag?

Oh, man. All right, let's get into it. Hi, Jordan and Gabe. I'm in my forties and in a marriage where we've been living separate lives for a couple of years now. Then a couple months ago, I received an unsolicited message from an attractive woman. She said she was a friend of a friend moving to the area and started by asking some questions about the neighborhood.

She quickly became flirtatious. So I did a reverse image search and discovered that the picture belonged to a different woman.

[00:03:32] Jordan Harbinger: Nice. That's smart. Um, you know what, this sort of catfishing stuff can be really tricky on Instagram, right? It's really obvious. They all use the same name in the same script, but if somebody's targeting you, really reverse image search is like the, that's your first stop.

[00:03:46] Gabriel Mizrahi: When I contacted that woman, she told me she'd previously had her picture used by an ex-boyfriend whom she now has no contact with. It turns out this ex is now the current boyfriend of my wife's cousin. So it looks like I'm getting catfished by an in-laws partner.

[00:04:02] Jordan Harbinger: See now I wish I'd saved my whole up soundbite for now.

That one's gonna come in handy a lot today. Yeah. Dang. Wow. This is so bizarre. So, so I gotta make sure I got this straight. This guy. So our friend here mm-hmm. He's being catfished. By his wife's cousin's boyfriend

[00:04:19] Gabriel Mizrahi: who used to date this other woman whose photo he's using. That's right.

[00:04:23] Jordan Harbinger: Okay. And for those who don't know, catfishing, can you define catfishing real quick?

[00:04:27] Gabriel Mizrahi: Yeah, so catfishing is like luring somebody online into a relationship by pretending to be somebody or not.

[00:04:33] Jordan Harbinger: Not just what everyone does online because it is kind of sort like this, but it'll be like someone posts a photo and is just, that's not your photo. It's literally not you. Right? It's just somebody else.

Different gender, different look, different age, whatever. It's okay. Got it. So there was a whole

[00:04:46] Gabriel Mizrahi: show about it. There was, which was weirdly fascinating. I think it might even still be on.

[00:04:50] Jordan Harbinger: Yeah. That guy built a whole career off of investigating. Catfishing and stuff. I, I've seen a couple episodes. I, I feel like this is something you watch on an airplane, kind of, but it's

[00:04:58] Gabriel Mizrahi: weirdly entertaining.

It is. And the people they find are so bizarre. It's a strange thing to do.

[00:05:04] Jordan Harbinger: The mental process that goes into it is so strange. I remember there was one where it was like a, it was like a gay dude pretending to be a blonde woman, and then he was talking to this football player and then he was like, I just wanna meet him in real life and explain everything and then he'll understand and then we'll still be in love.

And I'm like, dude, what? Yeah. That's not gonna happen. Yeah. It's just makes no sense at all. Just totally shocking. So I can't wait to hear where this goes. 'cause this is officially the champagne bottle being smashed on the hull of this week's dues cruise.

[00:05:33] Gabriel Mizrahi: So he goes on, I think there are three possible reasons he's doing this.

One, he's trying to get me in an embarrassing situation, which my wife could then use as grounds for getting a better settlement in a divorce. Mm oof. That's a dark possibility.

[00:05:47] Jordan Harbinger: Yeah, that actually makes some sense. Good thinking.

[00:05:49] Gabriel Mizrahi: I don't think that means my wife is involved. There are no indications of that though.

It is possible. So I need to be careful. I'm trying to imagine a scenario, Jordan, where that could be happening and his wife wouldn't be involved. Like so somebody would just be trying to,

[00:06:03] Jordan Harbinger: yeah, it seems weird. Like, Hey, I got you a present for Christmas, like catfished your husband, and now he's sending me dick pics.

[00:06:08] Gabriel Mizrahi: Like what? Yeah. I mean, maybe. I don't know. I just got you half of his 401k. You're welcome. Yeah.

[00:06:14] Jordan Harbinger: Weird.

[00:06:15] Gabriel Mizrahi: He goes on, my wife and I live in the same house and I don't want to end up having to sell the house and upset the kids. Wow. That is just such a weird scenario. There's a lot going on here. Yeah, there's a lot going on in this marriage and it's not even the thing he's asking about.

FYI. I haven't done anything wrong so far that would cause a divorce and haven't taken any embarrassing selfies. Okay, good. Thank God. Mm-hmm. Possibility two. He's doing this on his own initiative and will soon be trying to blackmail me if I play along much more.

[00:06:41] Jordan Harbinger: Yeah, so that's where I'm going with this because if you think your wife doesn't know this guy could be like, by the way, I can make your divorce a hell of a lot worse if you don't give me $10,000 or whatever.

[00:06:50] Gabriel Mizrahi: The dilemma I'm in is that once I found out who's doing the catfishing, a good looking guy in his late twenties who I've met at family events and found attractive. I've started to really enjoy the flirtatious messages. Oh man, again, I should

[00:07:04] Jordan Harbinger: have saved my holdups. I should just go back and, yeah. What on earth?

[00:07:08] Gabriel Mizrahi: Just keep your finger on the soundboard button. 'cause that's gonna keep happening.

[00:07:11] Jordan Harbinger: That hold up soundbite is So this, this just all what? Wait, what am I continue? Am I hearing what I think I'm hearing?

[00:07:18] Gabriel Mizrahi: While I assume he doesn't know that I've discovered his identity, I like to think that actually he might know and could be messaging me with his own wishes, which is possibility number three.

[00:07:29] Jordan Harbinger: Wow. This story's got legs. Gabe, what is happening? Catfish. Ception over here. Seriously, this is fascinating. So Michael Jackson Popcorn gif.

[00:07:39] Gabriel Mizrahi: Keep going. I previously wondered whether he was perhaps bisexual and given this situation and realizing this may apply to me as well. Mm-hmm. He's a bit of a bravado jock who would never openly say any of these things, so that makes me wonder if he's secretly enjoying the messages too, as he clearly knows they're coming to me.

Knowing. It's really him telling me her desires is exciting and makes it feel like we have a secret relationship. I could be kidding myself, but when we've met before, he's behaved in a way that was quite attractive arm around the shoulder type thing. But he does this with some other people too. So it could be a false alarm if we ever did get together.

It would need to be covert for us both given his jock image and my wish to not provide grounds for divorce, and it's likely to be short-lived, but thrilling. But I feel a bit guilty as I'm now effectively reverse catfishing the catfish and getting a twisted pleasure out of it. And I know I can't keep this up forever.

[00:08:37] Jordan Harbinger: Uh, okay, so technically you're not reverse catfishing the catfish because you are who you say you are. You're just a very self-aware, clever cat fishy who's about to step in it. I think.

[00:08:48] Gabriel Mizrahi: I don't have any firm evidence of this, but if this turns out to be a tactic for a divorce, it will definitely become known who's involved and could implode as a strategy as the catfish couldn't hide and would be legally liable if it looked like blackmail and blackmail would be very clumsy, and the likely legal trouble should put this guy off.

The sensible thing to do is to tell him the game's up and that I've been stringing him along for a while, for a laugh. But it's also the boring thing, and I'd be denying myself something that could be fun.

[00:09:18] Jordan Harbinger: Oh, okay. This is so insane. I mean, you're not wrong, man, but my God, you're playing with fire here.

What do you

[00:09:24] Gabriel Mizrahi: think I should do? Should I tell him I know it's him and finish it? Or should I say that I've known it was him for a while and that I'd like us to continue without the pretense to see if he'd like to start a real physical relationship? Or is that taking advantage of him as he may agree?

Just to avoid being exposed as a catfish, which is also kind of hot. Oh, like, yeah. Okay. This is too much. Is this real or is this whole thing just twisted and doomed? Signed ish to tempt this catfish or unselfish to pursue a new wish? First

[00:09:58] Jordan Harbinger: things

[00:09:58] Gabriel Mizrahi: first.

[00:09:59] Jordan Harbinger: Bruh. Second thing, a bro to Max. Yes. What I can understand the last one right off the bat.

Definitely twisted and doomed. Yeah. But that doesn't mean that there isn't a part of me that absolutely wants you to keep this up so you can keep giving us updates and we can air them and see how this whole thing plays out. Because this is Please, bananas. Bananas. This is a new one for us, Gabe. I gotta say, and I've, I've seen a lot of ish in the last, like two decades of doing this podcast.

Jordan just lit a cigarette when he said that. Yeah, I'm just ashing onto my, my microphone. I've

[00:10:29] Gabriel Mizrahi: seen it all on feedback Friday, but I'd never seen some shit like this. That's right. That's right. An unfiltered cigarette. Yeah. Whole new species of Des Wow. Right here. We're gonna need a, we're gonna need a whole new champagne bottle.

That's right. A whole new des phylum For sure.

[00:10:43] Jordan Harbinger: Reverse catfishing your catfish. Scamming your scammer, and getting the weirdest thrill out of it, but not like the thrill of justice. No, no, no. He's getting off on this. There's a sexual component to it that makes this so complicated and fascinating.

[00:10:56] Gabriel Mizrahi: Yeah. It's part revenge, part fantasy, part self-exploration.

There's so much happening in this.

[00:11:02] Jordan Harbinger: Yeah. But this catfish, he has no idea that our friend here is engaging in a fantasy or a role play. He just thinks that our friend thinks he's engaging with another woman. So they're having two totally different experiences here. But that is part of the

[00:11:15] Gabriel Mizrahi: thrill because our friend

[00:11:16] Jordan Harbinger: here is one step ahead of this guy.

Right. Fascinating. So obviously the responsible thing to do, the clean thing to do is to tell him, you know, it's him and put an end to this. That's the best way to minimize the drama, the inevitable fallout, and avoid getting yourself into an increasingly messy situation.

[00:11:33] Gabriel Mizrahi: Okay. I mean, way to go with the boring choice, Jordan.

I know, I know. No, you're right. The longer you string this guy along, the worse it's gonna be when you finally tell him,

[00:11:41] Jordan Harbinger: or when he finally figures it out, which he eventually will. But like I said, there's a part of me dark Jordan, I guess, that just wants you to keep going, just to have the story and also look, he tries to blackmail you.

You know that it's him and you're like, actually, I've got documentation that I know it's you, so I'm just gonna get the police involved. I mean, it's, mm-hmm. You could really have this guy wrapped around your finger and look, you're welcome to do that. Just know that you're playing with fire a little bit here.

If this blows up in your face somehow, like things escalate, your wife finds out, this guy tries to blackmail you. Like I said, or or his girlfriend, your wife's cousin finds out you guys are having some weird, sorted sexting relationship. Mm-hmm. You just have to be willing to accept the consequences. I mean, you said you have kids.

Two. So it's like, hmm, you know, you gotta be careful. There's a lot at stake. Yeah. Yeah. It's not like you're single and some guy you know is doing this to you. That would be kind of different. Then I would say like, yeah, tease this guy until he tries to blackmail you and then call the FBI or whatever. So my advice is think through these consequences right now.

Imagine all of them playing out exactly as you fear, and ask yourself how you'd handle them. And if you'd be kicking your past self for not ending this sooner, or if you'd be willing to accept the costs to have your fun now, which is just like never worth it. Pretty much

[00:12:50] Gabriel Mizrahi: what concerns me the most about all of this is the assumptions that our friend here is making about this guy that are feeding the fantasy.

Mm-hmm. Right. He said that he likes to think that this guy actually might know that he knows who he is, that he could be texting him with his own wishes.

[00:13:03] Jordan Harbinger: Yeah. I gotta say, I'm not sure how likely that is. That feels like a.

[00:13:06] Gabriel Mizrahi: Quite a reach. It does feel like a reach. He said he wondered if this guy was bi.

He's obviously hoping that he is, so there's a part of him that wants it to be true that he's secretly enjoying all of this.

[00:13:16] Jordan Harbinger: Right? Because it's exciting to him and it makes him feel like we have a secret relationship, but I, I just feel like he's constructing this in his head.

[00:13:23] Gabriel Mizrahi: But then he said that when they met in person, the guy was kind of flirtatious.

He put his arm around him and stuff like that.

[00:13:29] Jordan Harbinger: Okay. But he also said he does that with other people too. So, yeah, I mean,

[00:13:32] Gabriel Mizrahi: like I do that with pe. Like, you hug, I'm a hug guy at a party. Right. So like, yeah, a hugger, maybe this guy is just super friendly and affectionate, and our friend here is reading what he wants into that behavior.

Mm-hmm. Or who knows, maybe he has some really good gaar and there was some charged moment in the kitchen or something and we don't know about it. And so he has a strong hunch that this guy is into him. I, I suppose that's possible,

[00:13:52] Jordan Harbinger: but I feel like he would've said that if that happened. Instead, he just has this like one arm around the shoulder, which he does with a lot of people thing.

[00:13:59] Gabriel Mizrahi: Right. And then he said that if they ever did get together, it would have to be on the D. It would probably be short-lived, but thrilling. But let's remember, he has very little evidence of that. Oh, I would argue. No, no real evidence. Yeah, pretty much none. So connecting these dots that probably don't exist.

Imagining a certain version of how this story plays out. That's part of the fantasy, and that's fine. Fantasies are often illogical, improbable, a little crazy. That's part of what makes them fantasies. That's also why they're private, but it's only fine if he's not confusing the fantasy with the reality of the situation.

I. What I'm hearing is that he's kind of blending the two, and that's where I get a little bit worried for him. I'm not saying he's crazy or anything like that. I'm not even saying he's wrong for hoping that they could be something, but as he decides what to do here, I think he has to be very clear and very careful about not letting the two mix too much.

He needs to make sure his fantasy is not dictating his reality because for all he knows and what seems to be the likely scenario here, he's texting with a guy who has some other reason for catfishing him a potentially quite alarming reason. He might be blind to that because he's so caught up having fun, enjoying this fantasy.

[00:15:08] Jordan Harbinger: Yeah. Look, I totally agree. I also think we just, can we just remember how fricking weird it is that this guy is doing this in the first place? Yeah. First of all, he's using his ex-girlfriend's photo to catfish someone in his own family,

[00:15:23] Gabriel Mizrahi: and apparently it's not his first time, according to his ex. That's worrisome.

[00:15:28] Jordan Harbinger: That's right. He's a serial catfish, which just sort of seems mentally not all there to me. Yeah. Second, whether he's catfishing our friend here because he's actually into him, but just can't come out and say that whether he is doing it because he's trying to give his girlfriend's cousin grounds for divorce, whether he's planning on blackmailing this guy.

Whether he is just bored and he wants to mess with somebody, whatever it is, it's messed up. It's so weird to do this.

[00:15:48] Gabriel Mizrahi: There is something wrong with this guy. Yes, I don't know what he's up to, but it's not normal.

[00:15:53] Jordan Harbinger: Seriously wrong. This is not, you know, odd but understandable behavior. This guy is just, when you think about it, taking time out of his day to pose as his ex-girlfriend and send his girlfriend's, cousin's husband flirty messages in a lot of them for some creepy, probably nefarious reason.

I just don't want our friend here to lose sight of that. That is so freaking weird.

[00:16:16] Gabriel Mizrahi: Well, again, I think that's another way that the fantasy and the reality are blurring in a worrisome way, or his desire to buy into the fantasy is making him vulnerable to the risks here. I mean, look, he came right out and said, this guy might in fact be trying to screw me over.

So he's not completely unaware of that possibility, but I do think his judgment might be a little compromised to some degree by his excitement.

[00:16:39] Jordan Harbinger: Agreed. So yes, you certainly have the option of coming clean and saying, Hey, I know this is you. I'd like to explore this for real. You wanna go on a date? But again, I would really think through all the ways that could play out.

He could say yes. He could say, no. Look, you're putting this in writing, which is not good. Look, if he says yes, now you're what? Low key dating your wife's cousin's boyfriend or stealing him from her or causing him to cheat on her. If he says no, family get togethers might get super awkward. You're gonna have to manage that as well as any fallout from busting him.

So again, consider the implications and what outcomes you're comfortable living with.

[00:17:12] Gabriel Mizrahi: But, but look as for your banger of a final question. Literally would asking him to explore things for real, be taking advantage of him if he agrees to date you, just to avoid being exposed, which you also apparently find kind of hot.

Unreal. God, that really depends on how you ask him. I mean, if you say, Hey, I want you to come over and if you don't come over, I'm gonna tell your girlfriend and her whole family what you did. And I'm gonna post screenshots of our messages. I'm gonna tell everyone at Thanksgiving that I was exposing you.

That's one thing that would be, I mean, I think that's kind of extortion, right?

[00:17:46] Jordan Harbinger: Yeah. That's a crime too, as well as being unethical despite how weird this dude is.

[00:17:51] Gabriel Mizrahi: But if you come clean and you say, look, I get the sense that you might be enjoying this. I'm happy to tell you that I am too. If you're open to talking about this, if you want to tell me why you did it and what you're looking to get out of this, and that conversation goes well in some scenario, and it naturally progresses to you guys basically saying, well, I'm into you.

I'm into you, and do you want to date? Yeah, sure, let's do it. Obviously, that's a very different story,

[00:18:12] Jordan Harbinger: but again, Gabe, the fact that he feels it might be taking advantage of him because he has some power over this guy. Which he finds hot. Isn't that yet another example of the fantasy just taking over here?

[00:18:22] Gabriel Mizrahi: Yeah, I think it is. Unless what he's saying is I might actually be willing to extort this guy in order to sleep with him, in which case the fantasy and the reality are somehow merging. Again, I'm so confused. I know, right? But I don't think that's what he's saying. No, I don't think that's what he's getting out either.

The sense I get is that he's exploring aspects of his sexuality that are still kind of new for him. They're taboo, they're a little underground, they're not fully explored. Right. And this is his chance,

[00:18:46] Jordan Harbinger: right? Yeah. He's still married to his wife. It sounds like he's just now starting to realize that he might be bisexual.

So that tells us a lot about where he is in his journey. So

[00:18:55] Gabriel Mizrahi: when he says, man, that would be hot. He might just be taking this opportunity to share a piece of the fantasy with us to tell us where he is.

[00:19:02] Jordan Harbinger: Right. Not to express like his in intent for this. Yeah. Right.

[00:19:05] Gabriel Mizrahi: Okay. Right. But again, I'm sorry to repeat myself.

I cannot stress this enough. This is another area where you really need to separate out. What turns you on from what is appropriate and responsible and prudent here because there's something about your personality or maybe just this situation. It sounds to me like it's very tempting for you to paint with both colors in this situation, so to speak.

[00:19:26] Jordan Harbinger: Yeah, that's a good way to put it. He's painting with two colors, maybe more, and I'm just not sure. What painting he's making over here.

[00:19:32] Gabriel Mizrahi: Yeah. Well, and by the way, we're not talking about your orientation. We're talking, I'm talking about fantasy and reality here. Right, right, right. Neither he doesn't know what painting he's making either.

And that's what's fascinating about this and what's also kind of terrifying.

[00:19:43] Jordan Harbinger: In one way, I admire the brazenness and his playfulness. Right. And in another way though, I'm wincing and I'm going, okay, this is fulfilling a certain function for you that is not entirely healthy and this, this is not gonna end well.

[00:19:55] Gabriel Mizrahi: No, I thought you were wincing 'cause uh, you just got a vasectomy. But yeah, I, I'm also wi choices

[00:20:00] Jordan Harbinger: because, because I, I've had my scrotum punctured by a doctor's, right. With very little anesthetics. So my strong advice to you is, by the way, you know you're awake when they do that. Like, I was chitchatting with the doctor.

No, dude, I had no idea. I thought they put you under for that. Absolutely not. No. You can sort of like see most of what's going on, but you're at a weird angle. If you're eating lunch right now, I apologize, but yeah, no, you feel the polling and the sewing and the chatting and then the, it feels like someone's flicking you really hard in the junk in the nuts.

What'd you guys talk about the podcast.

[00:20:31] Gabriel Mizrahi: Oh, cool.

[00:20:32] Jordan Harbinger: He's like, oh, I like podcasts. What do you guys talk about? I'm like, well, we're gonna be talking about this vasectomy pretty soon. For sure. Usually not just that. Yeah. Did you talk

[00:20:39] Gabriel Mizrahi: about feedback Friday, or did you talk about the interviews?

[00:20:41] Jordan Harbinger: A little bit of both.

A little bit of both. Hmm. And he is like, oh, that's interesting. You know, and he grew up, you know, and he was in the military. Part of that was him being interested, I think. And part of that was the more I'm talking, the less I'm, you know, tensing up and being weird while he's trying to get something done.

Oh, he is just disarming you. Yeah. Because there's a lot. Well, disarming. Yes, yes. He was disarming me. Um, indeed he was. That was, that's the whole point of the surgery. Mm-hmm. Surgery. Yeah. It's an interesting vibe because, you know, he's done like 10,000 of these things. Right. You can just tell.

[00:21:12] Gabriel Mizrahi: Yeah. I love that you're describing your vasectomy appointment as a vibe, but go on.

It's a vibe. It's a vibe.

[00:21:18] Jordan Harbinger: Yeah. Driving home was also a vibe. Um, 'cause you drive yourself home. Like they're basically just like, oh yeah. Take Tylenol. And you're just thinking, I've taken Tylenol and I'm pretty sure that that's not going to cut.

[00:21:27] Gabriel Mizrahi: It does nothing. Yeah. I didn't fall off my skateboard when I was 12.

Whatcha talking about I don't have a scraped knee pal? Um, that's not what we're dealing with here. Oh man. Anyway,

[00:21:37] Jordan Harbinger: you know who doesn't need a vasectomy

[00:21:39] Clip Filler: guy? Exactly.

[00:21:40] Jordan Harbinger: Yeah. This guy, a if you find out you're gay, you don't need a vasectomy. So there's that. But anyway, back to the task at hand here. My strong advice to you is proceed with caution.

Stay grounded, stay sober. Really consider the risks and implications here, and whatever you're getting out of this game, whatever you are learning about yourself and your desires and your needs, that's for you to know and do something about, not necessarily to take to this guy to explore. Take care of yourself and good

[00:22:09] Gabriel Mizrahi: luck, Jordan.

Just imagine if these two do end up getting together. Hmm. What an origin

[00:22:13] Jordan Harbinger: story that would be. Tell me about it. I mean, one, you shouldn't feed this delusion, but two. Yeah. How did you guys meet? Well, Lionel catfished me as his ex-girlfriend because he was in the closet too, and I thought it was super fun and hilarious and yada, yada yada.

Yeah. Yeah.

[00:22:27] Gabriel Mizrahi: Yada yada. Yeah. Lionel almost blackmail me, but we grabbed lattes and we realized we're actually really into each other. What a tale. Also, Lionel's a great name. It is. It's such a catfish name.

[00:22:37] Jordan Harbinger: It's a name you get from a scammer who has two first names. Like, hi, my name is Lionel Jennifer. I'm a banker for the Saudi prince.

Jennifer. Yeah.

[00:22:45] Gabriel Mizrahi: The worst

[00:22:45] Jordan Harbinger: scammer name I've ever heard. They always pick two first names. I'm not sure why.

[00:22:49] Gabriel Mizrahi: All I can say is if you decide to continue, you have to send us updates because we need to know what happens and we will air

[00:22:56] Jordan Harbinger: them. Yes. Yes, indeed. I. And now for some Extortionately good deals on the fine products and services that support this show, we'll be right back.

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Please consider supporting those who support the show now. Back to feedback Friday.

[00:25:33] Gabriel Mizrahi: Alright, what's next? Dear Jordan and Gabe, I have a foreign name and I've noticed that it can sometimes be challenging in professional settings, especially when it comes to standing out or being memorable. It's also just annoying to have every small talk conversation revolve around the pronunciation of my name, and if I don't meet people face to face, they often misgender me.

I'm curious to hear your thoughts on how someone with a name that's unfamiliar or difficult to pronounce can successfully build a strong personal brand. I don't mind having a nickname, but I do wanna let people know that I'm from Lithuania. Are there any strategies or tips you recommend to overcome potential obstacles while still maintaining authenticity signed?

Avoiding these size and hanging onto my pride without a pronunciation guide.

[00:26:15] Jordan Harbinger: Interesting. It's funny, I had a buddy from Lithuania, his name was something like Mengas. Mengas. Yeah. But his middle name sounded like Marcus, so we just called him Marcus. Or maybe that's the nickname that he picked because he was like, ah, no one can remember to call me Mengas.

So I, so I get it. Marcus, Jennifer Menga. Jennifer. So I get this, I've dealt with this myself in some ways. When I lived in Serbia. People used to call me Jole because they couldn't say Jordan easily 'cause of the way the consonants were Jole. Jole. Yeah. It's kinda like Johnson. Is it like Dick? Mm-hmm. So girls would giggle when they heard it.

Oh, like Johnson Johnson?

[00:26:48] Gabriel Mizrahi: Yes. So they were just like going around calling you like Wiener?

[00:26:51] Jordan Harbinger: Yeah. Yeah. Hopefully it wasn't quite that lame, but it might be. I don't know if you're Serbian, tell me what Jole evokes for you. So I totally get that. Some, they would also call me Johnny just 'cause it was funnier and I think some guys didn't wanna say jole all the time.

So I totally get that having a foreign name can be really challenging in another country, some more than others of course. And yes, it must be annoying to have to constantly explain to people how to pronounce your name or tell them, eh, actually I'm a woman, or actually I'm a guy over and over again. I also think that having a foreign name can be really cool and help you stand out, which is obviously a big part of personal branding.

Even if it means going around being called dong or, you know, I, I could, but you know what I'm saying. So my take is if you're gonna adopt a local name, something easier for people to wrap their heads around, try to find one that's somewhat cool and unique and meaningful to you. A lot of Chinese people, they come to the United States and they do this, but I've noticed this, especially with kids, that they'll pick names like Cherry.

You know, it's a little bit like, uh, okay, it's a cartoon character kind of name, or a stripper kind of name. I also wouldn't go with, you know, Meg, I mean, you're welcome to, and no shade to Megs, but there are a lot of megs in the us. There's way fewer. Violets also a popular name with Chinese people who come over.

So I'm just plucking a random example out of the air here. If you happen to like the color violet, or you're into flowers or whatever, that would be more meaningful than just going with a generic local name. Your other option is to find a nickname or variant on your real name. That way, you're still getting to hang onto your real name.

You're just making it a little easier for people to pronounce. Like if her name is Vena, you just go by Lana. That kind of thing. Not that Svetlana is hard to pronounce, but you get the point. But look, there's a big part of me that wants to say, own your name, be proud of it. Let other people adjust. Like you said, you always wanna lead with authenticity here.

So if a name change feels super false, I just consider hanging onto your real one or waiting until you find a local one that feels right. There's no rush. I just don't think it's the worst thing for local people to learn a name in another language. We Americans, I'm assuming you're here in the States, we can adjust sometimes too.

Here's another idea. All when you introduce yourself, maybe you get out in front of all the questions you used to getting, Hey, I am beta. I just met at beta from Latvia, so that's top of my mind right now. I'm beta, like Beirut, uh, like the city except with beer, like the drink. I know it's unique. It'll take a couple times for you to remember me.

Thanks mom and dad. You know, just have a laugh about it. Call it out. Give the person a couple mnemonics to remember it. When you do stuff like that, you'll also be showing people that you have a sense of humor and that stands out even more. And they'll remember the Beirut beer thing. They'll remember your attitude, which again, doesn't hurt from a branding perspective.

Another thing I've seen people from other countries do, you could add something to your email signature or your social media accounts, beta originally from Lithuania, global approach or whatever. You can even include a pronunciation guide if you want. They have this, I don't know if they still have this, 'cause I haven't logged into Facebook in like a decade, but on Facebook it used to show you how to pronounce people's names.

So it'd be like beru, just a small thing that can help prevent any hiccups and sidestep that annoying conversation. But look, whatever you decide to do, don't be afraid to own your story. It's unique, it's interesting, it's damn impressive. Moving to another country has no small feed. I've done it a bunch.

It's never easy. You should be proud of that. And if you stick with your real name. It might be a cool window into that conversation. Like if you say, Hey, I'm Beta, and the other person is like, be what? You can be like Beta, it's Lithuanian crazy name. I know it's made. Moving here. Way more interesting. And then eight outta 10 people are gonna go, oh, cool.

How long have you been here? Wow, I've never met anyone from Lithuania. And all of a sudden you're talking about your story, not just how to pronounce your name, that they're gonna forget 10 seconds later. But listen more than whatever name you settle on. The most important thing in your relationships, in your personal brand is of course you.

How you show up in these conversations, what vibe you put out, what spirit you meet people in. Your kindness, your curiosity, your humor, your vulnerability, your work ethic. Those things matter way more. And if you keep leading with those qualities, I promise you are gonna make a name for yourself literally.

Okay? And good luck. You can reach us friday@jordanharbinger.com. Please keep your emails concise. Try to use a descriptive subject line that makes our job a whole lot easier. If your partner secretly reads your journal and is holding the contents against you, you're struggling to parent with a criminal narcissistic ex, or your work nemesis is caught up in a romance scam and you're not sure whether to savor whatever's.

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[00:31:40] Gabriel Mizrahi: Dear Jordan and Gabe, my 23-year-old son was commissioned an officer in the military last year following grueling undergraduate academics and ROTC at a top tier school.

He's currently in very academically stressful military training with constant 12 plus hour days of varying shifts and regular testing before he goes into the force to do the job. I recently visited him and while cleaning his room, he still lives like a teenage boy. I found some erectile dysfunction medication.

I asked him about it and he initially denied that he had any issues and said that it helped him in his workouts. He's a gym Rat lifts daily and has become very fit over the last three years, although he still vapes regularly. I. But I pressed him and he admitted that he has performance issues, but he's quote Okay.

By himself, unquote.

[00:32:30] Jordan Harbinger: So, uh, wait. Okay. By himself, does that mean okay being single or does that mean he can handle it when he is enjoying me time and nothing goes wrong or I don't, I don't get it

[00:32:39] Gabriel Mizrahi: from the way he wrote that sentence. I think he meant the latter.

[00:32:41] Jordan Harbinger: I see. Got it. So there's something going on when he has a partner, which I'm guessing this means it's psychological.

You hear a lot about the younger generation needing this 'cause they watch too much freaking porn.

[00:32:51] Gabriel Mizrahi: Yeah. Well, I guess that's po We don't know. Physical, psychological, both.

[00:32:56] Jordan Harbinger: Yeah.

[00:32:56] Gabriel Mizrahi: I do not believe he has regular sex. He might have only been with two or three partners since his sophomore year in high school.

I asked if he had talked to anyone about this issue. He said, I'm just really stressed, grind my teeth at night so much. My jaw hurts in the morning, don't sleep well and have more important things to worry about. Besides, no wonder I have issues with you and mom harping on about don't get anyone pregnant.

[00:33:19] Jordan Harbinger: Interesting. Okay. So stress can definitely, of course, play a role in erectile dysfunction and it sounds like this guy has a lot of stress in his life right now, especially with the teeth grinding and stuff like that. If your jaw hurts in the morning, you're really, you're going after it. I have to imagine the vaping does not help,

[00:33:33] Gabriel Mizrahi: but he's saying something else here.

He's saying his parents have given him some kind of complex, right, by warning him about getting somebody pregnant.

[00:33:41] Jordan Harbinger: Look, whether that's true or not, that does seem like a meaningful detail. Let's come back to that.

[00:33:45] Gabriel Mizrahi: Oh, by the way, he hates the training, as do many of his peers and did not pick this military specialty.

Yeah, he was drafted into it based on his good grades and caliber of school. He attended like a few of his peers in the specialty. I don't want him to have the empty sex that I had through my twenties and early thirties, but I do want him to be happy, healthy, and strong, and not have Ed. It brings me to tears knowing that he's so dissatisfied.

I'm so proud of how he's pushing through and succeeding at this training, but I don't want his mental or physical health to suffer as a result of his professional successes. Could this Ed be temporary? How can I help him with any of this? Signed wondering about the feasibility of confronting my son's des ability when it comes to his virility.

[00:34:29] Jordan Harbinger: Okay. Well, lot of firsts on today's episode. Pretty sure we've never had a parent writing it about their child's erectile dysfunction before. Yeah. We're gonna need a third bottle of champagne over here, I think. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. So first of all, I can hear how much you love your son. I can hear how proud you are of him and how concerned you are about him in a number of ways.

I think it's sweet that you want what's best for your son. You want him to have the healthiest life possible, the most fulfilling life possible. I get it. I'm sure if I found out my son was struggling in this area, I'd be worried too. But I am not sure this is an area of your son's life that you should be super involved in, especially if he's not coming up to you and saying, Hey dad, I'm struggling with this.

I need a little bit of help. Again, I get your concern. I get why you want your son to thrive. We're talking about your son's sex life. You know, we're talking about his body at his age. I kind of think this is his problem to work on in the way that he wants. He's 23. I don't feel like it's appropriate for you to be trying to make sure your son can get it up a sentence.

I never thought I would say out loud, but here we are.

[00:35:27] Gabriel Mizrahi: Well quite, and this is a bit of a theme in this letter, how involved and possibly over-involved he is in his son's life.

[00:35:34] Jordan Harbinger: Well, yeah, I picked up on that as well.

[00:35:36] Gabriel Mizrahi: It was interesting. The first thing that jumped out at me was that he discovered the ED medication while cleaning his son's room, his 23-year-old son's room, who's about to become an elite officer in the military.

[00:35:46] Jordan Harbinger: So I get it. There always are babies and I was probably a slob at 23, but that is a bit odd. I agree. I don't know, maybe he went to visit the academy for a parent's weekend or whatever and saw that his room was a mess and he was like. Here, I'll help you as long as I'm here. I'm sure my mom probably did that a few times when I was in my early twenties.

I could see that. My roommate's mom definitely did. She cleaned her room. It was, but he was, well nevermind.

[00:36:06] Gabriel Mizrahi: Okay. So fair. I guess that's possible. But when you said he still lives like a teenage boy, that's another interesting detail. It makes me wonder if the son is extremely capable, hyper developed in certain departments and in other departments.

He might be a little immature or regressed in certain ways and dad is still in the mode of I need to help you do basic things like clean your room so you can function. And I guess my question is, does that speak to a broader dynamic between them?

[00:36:31] Jordan Harbinger: Right. And if he's overly involved in his son's life in small ways, is he also overly involved in his son's life in the big ways?

Like talking about his erectile dysfunction?

[00:36:40] Gabriel Mizrahi: Yes. The other meaningful detail is the thing you reacted to how his son said, no wonder I have issues. You know when you and mom are always like banging on about don't get sorry for the choice of words harping on about don't get anyone pregnant.

[00:36:51] Jordan Harbinger: Right. That one might be different though.

That doesn't sound like being overly involved to me. I mean, I think every parent should probably warn their kids about having safe sex.

[00:36:59] Gabriel Mizrahi: Yeah, I agree. But what he's saying is, there's something about the way you did it that kind of messed me up. You, you didn't just educate me. You freaked me out about it.

He said the word harped. I mean, the word harped kind of speaks volumes to me.

[00:37:13] Jordan Harbinger: Right, right. 'cause if they were harping on about this, that might have tipped over into something else. Some kind of anxiety, something obsessive who knows?

[00:37:20] Gabriel Mizrahi: Something potentially inappropriate and overly involved. It's possible.

[00:37:24] Jordan Harbinger: I guess I could see that. But to be fair to our friend here, his son is saying that that's what's causing his erectile dysfunction. Or at least contributing to it. But I mean, we don't know if that's actually the reason.

[00:37:34] Gabriel Mizrahi: And that's also a fair point. I mean, for all we know, mom and dad were just guiding him and they stayed within the lines, but the fact that his son said that to him in a heated way.

I don't know about you, Jordan, but I'm hearing a young man who feels a bit stifled, a bit angry, you know, whether this particular conversation about safe sex was handled well or not.

[00:37:52] Jordan Harbinger: That's true. It's also possible that he was embarrassed that his dad found the pills and he was just deflecting by blaming his parents for screwing him up somehow.

[00:37:59] Gabriel Mizrahi: Yeah, also possible, or it's both. We just don't know. But then our friend here also seems to know a lot about his son's sex life. He doesn't think that he's having regular sex. He seems to know how many partners his son has had he straight up asked his son if he has performance issues. And then when his son didn't really want to talk about it, he said he pressed the issue.

All of that is pretty intimate information for a parent to know. So I guess here's what I'm getting at, and I tread lightly here because I know in certain families with certain parents, maybe sons and fathers talk about this stuff, and these topics are totally fair game and there's nothing weird about it.

So I'm not saying that this is automatically pathological. His son does not seem to want to talk about this stuff and yet here they are talking in intimate detail about it.

[00:38:41] Jordan Harbinger: So that kind of fits with a dad who might be probing too much. And meanwhile there's so many puns that I'm just so glad we're not making.

And meanwhile there are other details here, like the vaping that he doesn't seem to be Yes,

[00:38:52] Gabriel Mizrahi: probing no, but that's an important point. 'cause that's a big factor here.

[00:38:56] Jordan Harbinger: If I were this guy's dad, I'd be equally, if not more concerned about my son getting fricking popcorn lung and shortening his lifespan than the fact that he sometimes can't get it up.

Partly because the vaping is less sensitive and partly because, well, I also wonder if the vaping might be contributing to his erectile dysfunction, although I don't know if that's actually a thing. I know smoking definitely was.

[00:39:14] Gabriel Mizrahi: So it's funny, I looked this up and apparently that is a thing. Well,

[00:39:17] Jordan Harbinger: there you

[00:39:17] Gabriel Mizrahi: go.

There's more and more research coming out about this. I highly recommend Googling it, by the way. But one study I found, it was just one of many A-U-C-L-A study, found that men who used e-cigarettes every day were more than twice as likely to experience ed as those who had never vaped. There's a real connection there.

[00:39:34] Jordan Harbinger: So I mean, that could be the problem, or at least part of the problem. I guess. We haven't ruled out any neurosis he has because his parents freaked him out about getting girls pregnant or whatever.

[00:39:42] Gabriel Mizrahi: You know? There's one more thing in here that's jumping out at me. This thing he said about how his son hates the training he's doing and how he didn't pick this specialty and he was drafted into it based on his grades and the school he attended.

So again, I'm reading between the lines here as I am want to do, but I'm just imagining what a 23-year-old man in this position must be feeling. He hates his training, which, okay, we all go through tough chapters on our way to doing the thing we really want to do. I get that. I don't think anyone in the military is like over the moon about their training.

The fact that he didn't pick his specialty, the fact that he was sort of pulled into it by default, that he might not have truly chosen this path, that he might even be regretting or at least questioning it. I can imagine that that would bring up a number of feelings. So his son might be feeling anxious, he might be feeling terrified.

He might be angry, and I don't know at whom, maybe his school or the military or himself or his parents, or maybe everyone for not helping him see this before it happened. He might be having a A minor or not so minor professional crisis, or he is just really going through it right now and he might be feeling trapped and disempowered.

[00:40:46] Jordan Harbinger: Good point. And so you're saying maybe that's why he has performance issues?

[00:40:50] Gabriel Mizrahi: Well, that might be contributing to them. Yes, but actually I was drawing more of a potential connection between this feeling of being suffocated and disempowered in his career and this potential feeling of being suffocated and disempowered by his parents' over involvement in his life.

I guess what I'm wondering is, is this a theme that is popping up in a few areas for him?

[00:41:10] Jordan Harbinger: Ah, interesting. So is that at the root of his performance issues? It's a good question. Either way. I think it's pretty clear that their son is kind of chafing at a number of influences and situations in his life right now.

Again, sorry for all these, it's almost like it's top of mind. Um, I feel like everything is a pun for something to do with my scrotum today. Yeah, I saw,

[00:41:32] Gabriel Mizrahi: I saw your face when you said, I was like, does he know? Does he know what he is doing? Yeah, but no, I'm, I'm with you. I got you. I mean, look, it's, it's interesting.

Something as minor as not cleaning your room, there could be a number of explanations for that. I mean, yeah, one of them might be that he is just kind of a mess and he is not super on top of his little space or whatever. But it could also be that it's a form of rebellion, a kind of unconscious fu I wanna do things my way.

You know, I might be living in a mess, but it's on my terms kind of thing. So everything dad is noticing here, and I think it's really interesting that he chose to include these details about how his son feels about his career. When they seem sort of tangential to the whole ED thing, but I'm not sure that they are tangential.

All of this is probably a strong signal that they need to back off and let their son figure this out in his own way, at least for now. Not just because it's the appropriate thing to do, but because I do get the sense that this guy is craving some privacy and some freedom to make his own choices and work through his own problems.

[00:42:28] Jordan Harbinger: Yeah, I'm with you Gabe. That makes a lot of sense. Although, I suppose backing off also kind of means accepting that they might not understand everything about their son all the time.

[00:42:35] Gabriel Mizrahi: Yes. But that might be healthy for all of them, I think. Uh,

[00:42:39] Jordan Harbinger: so here's my take. I probably wouldn't meddle in your son's sex life too much.

From here on out, what you can do is say a look bud. You're an adult. You're a capable, responsible young man. I'm gonna respect your privacy on this, and if you ever wanna talk about anything, guy to guy, I'm here for that. You know, I've had the same equipment for a lot longer than you have, and in the meantime, I just wanna say, as somebody who loves you, vaping is truly awful for you.

I'm sure you know that. If you don't, please spend 10 minutes reading up on it online. I sincerely hope you quit as soon as possible. I think you'll find that it has ripple effects across your life. All I want for you is to be happy and healthy and fulfilled, and if I can do anything to help you get there, you know that I'm here.

That's how you can respect his privacy and autonomy while still being there for him and without inadvertently contributing to any additional stress or dysfunction. The other thing you can do, of course, is encourage him to talk to somebody. The military really should offer some type of counseling, probably free of charge.

Just keep an eye on that healthy boundary when you do so that pushing him into therapy doesn't become another way to potentially overstep and meddle in his life. And again, I know you're coming from a good place here, man. I know. I know you want your son to thrive. Every parent would, but sometimes the best thing we can do as parents, especially if a child your son's age is take a huge step back so that they can take that huge step forward, especially in sensitive areas like this.

Sending you and your son good thoughts and hope everything starts looking up from here. You had to do it. You had to. It just seemed better than sending you good thoughts. And I hope your son has rock hard boners from here on out, now we're giving this guy a complex, geez. That's right. And now you are gonna get a rock hard boner when you hear about the deals and discounts on the fine products and services that support this show.

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[00:46:42] Gabriel Mizrahi: Okay, next up. Greetings Jordan and Gabe. I have a wonderful girlfriend who I just bought a house with. We're finally living the life we hoped for. Close to activities, good food and good friends. The only hitch is my girlfriend's brother and their mother. Her brother has recently been diagnosed with bipolar disorder and it's really weighing on her family.

He just turned 17, so it's a delicate time for him. He doesn't see his dad a lot anymore due to his drinking and smoking, which make him uncomfortable, but that doesn't stop his dad from lying to him about his mom. They've been divorced for some time now, but his dad has told him how his mom locked him up, starved him, and ignored him throughout his childhood.

[00:47:22] Jordan Harbinger: Wow. Okay. That is dark.

[00:47:25] Gabriel Mizrahi: This has made my girlfriend's brother callous and even hateful toward their mom. He brushes her off, curses at her and gives her an air of disdain all the time, so their mom tries to make up for it by buying him everything he asks for, thinking it will somehow make things better.

She somehow accepted that she was a terrible mother, which is not true as I've seen her affection in action, but it's like money is the only thing she knows to turn to now.

[00:47:49] Jordan Harbinger: Yeah, interesting. So again, we don't know if she's doing this to win him back over or because she really did abuse him when he was a kid.

[00:47:55] Gabriel Mizrahi: Unclear. Okay. He's saying he doesn't think that the mom did any of this because what he's seen is that she's lovely, but Got it. Okay. I guess it's possible that she is, but then the dad is not a reliable narrator, so we don't know. So he goes on. I've also noticed both my girlfriend and her mom constantly praise the brother for every little thing he does.

Right. Which honestly irks me. He isn't feeling normal, so wouldn't he just wanna be treated normal? The only other person who seems to notice what's going on is my girlfriend's unofficial stepdad. He's made comments about the money he spends on my girlfriend's brother, but it never amounts to anything. I try to offer my girlfriend advice on what to do, but she always just ends on, it's a delicate time for him and I don't know what else to do.

Their dad was abusive to her in the past, so I can understand why she's struggling. She just wants the best for her brother.

[00:48:42] Jordan Harbinger: Okay. So dad was abusive, at least to her,

[00:48:44] Gabriel Mizrahi: apparently.

[00:48:45] Jordan Harbinger: Yeah. But dad is telling brother that mom abused him, which might or might not be true.

[00:48:49] Gabriel Mizrahi: Right? Although there's no evidence of that in the letter other than the mom's belief now that she was actually a bad mom.

This family. Yeah. Poor kids. So confusing. Yeah. I don't know how much longer I can stand by and watch this. It hurts to see as her brother's behavior and mistreatment are affecting everyone in the family. How do you recommend I go about trying to mend these slowly deteriorating relationships? Is it my place to talk to my girlfriend's brother?

What should I do? Signed, fed up with a vibe in my girlfriend's tribe.

[00:49:18] Jordan Harbinger: Oh boy, what a sad situation. There is a lot of pain in this story and a lot of directions, and I'm sure that most of these people mean well, but there's a lot of dysfunction in this family, man. So first of all, my heart goes out to your girlfriend's brother wrestling with bipolar disorder on top of a potential history of childhood abuse.

That is not easy. You said that he was recently diagnosed and I hope that means he's being treated for it. Medication therapy, ideally both. Bipolar disorder, when it's properly treated, it doesn't have to derail someone's life, but untreated it can obviously cause a lot of turbulence and a lot of pain for the person who has it, of course, but often also for family members, friends, loved ones.

It's really tough. My heart also goes out to you though, because this is all just really hard to watch. I hear your genuine concern in your letter. I also hear your anger, your disappointment, your frustration, your impatience. I'm getting the sense that you feel a responsibility to intervene and make things better here, but you also feel kind of helpless.

I. I'm guessing that helplessness just makes you angrier. 'cause it's like, why can't you people get it together? Why can't you treat one another better? Why can't you work through these wounds and grievances in a normal way? And I get that.

[00:50:26] Gabriel Mizrahi: I get that too. Another thing that's in the mix here is his feelings about how the mother showers prey on our son for every little thing he does.

Right. I find that very interesting.

[00:50:34] Jordan Harbinger: Yeah, that's right. He said it

[00:50:35] Gabriel Mizrahi: irks him. It irks him. Although it sounds, it sounds like it might be a little bit more than irks him because he said he isn't feeling normal, so wouldn't, he would just wanna be treated normal. Like uh, he sounds kind of angry,

[00:50:45] Jordan Harbinger: which I wasn't quite sure what he meant by that.

Is he saying if he's mentally ill, treating him like he's different is not what he needs.

[00:50:52] Gabriel Mizrahi: That seems to be his argument. Like why make him feel even more different and weirder by going out of your way to praise him every time he takes the car to the carwash or whatever, uhhuh, you know? But I don't know.

I feel like there might be more to that. I wonder, I wonder if watching this family bend over backward to accommodate this guy, to prop him up, to validate him, to make life easier for him. It seems to me that there's something about that that just does not sit very well with him. So obviously we don't have enough information in the letter to know why that is, but I don't know, am I crazy or is that jumping out to you two?

Like I feel like this is just like poking at him in a certain way. Maybe there's something in his own upbringing maybe. Maybe nobody accommodated him like that, and it's hard to watch it happen for somebody else, especially somebody who's causing so much havoc in his life. Via his girlfriend, but for some reason I feel like he might also be, I don't know.

I guess I'm wondering if he's kind of envious of this guy on some level.

[00:51:44] Jordan Harbinger: Yeah, I could see that what he's in touch with is his disdain and his anger, but underneath that, he might be going, why does he get that treatment slash, why didn't I get that treatment?

[00:51:53] Gabriel Mizrahi: Yeah, exactly. Just something for our friend here to consider, because I think part of what we're feeling our way through here is why does watching this family's pain hurt me so much and separating out these feelings might make this situation hurt a little bit less?

I think it would also help him figure out what piece of this he does control.

[00:52:11] Jordan Harbinger: Right? So obviously this family has a lot of work to do, but here's the thing, I'm just not convinced that it's our friend. Here's job to make them do that work. No. Okay. So you agree? Yeah, I feel the same. I get the impulse, uh, what could be more natural, but almost every aspect of this problem is this family's business and just not his business.

[00:52:28] Gabriel Mizrahi: Accept his relationship with his girlfriend.

[00:52:30] Jordan Harbinger: Accept his relationship with her. That's right. But look, I get why that gets confusing because I'm assuming that dad tells brother all this awful stuff about mom, brother than rages at her mom goes out of her way to keep him in good graces. One or both of them talk to sister about what's going on or she witnesses it herself.

Then she brings all that to our friend here and when our friend tries to help, she just says, what did she say? Like, oh, it's a delicate time for him. I don't know what else to do. I mean, it sounds like Gabe, this is that classic thing where you gotta know when someone's venting to you and when someone's asking for help.

And those are two different things. Like maybe she's venting to you and not wanting your solutions.

[00:53:05] Gabriel Mizrahi: Yeah. But that doesn't mean she doesn't need some help, some solutions, that's for sure. True, of course. But what she is saying to him back, it's a delicate time for him. I don't know else to do. That's a little bit of a non-response or it's a, an admission that she really cannot change any of this herself.

[00:53:21] Jordan Harbinger: Right. Plus her dad was apparently abusive to her, so she has her own trauma, her own stake in all this. So I get why our friend here is going, okay, if you, people won't do anything about this, what can I do? But really the only pieces of this that he can and should control. A, his own way of processing the feelings that this family stirs up in him.

And B, how he talks to his girlfriend about what's happening, how he supports her, how he guides and empowers her to work on her piece of all of this.

[00:53:49] Gabriel Mizrahi: Or I increasingly, I'm feeling like it's also to make peace with the fact that she can't do that and learn how to pull back.

[00:53:55] Jordan Harbinger: Exactly. And C, which is, I think the conclusion you're getting at Gabe, learning to draw better boundaries so that this family's chaos just doesn't infect his life so much.

And those boundaries are potentially with his girlfriend if she's bringing too much to him or involving him in an unfair way. But I. They might also be inside of himself in the way that he internalizes this family's dysfunction somehow, or decides that it's on him to fix when, when it's not.

[00:54:18] Gabriel Mizrahi: Yes, I think that's absolutely right and that's where that possible MV piece and how this family's way of dealing with its problems in general uniquely triggers him.

I think that's where that becomes really important, again, in my opinion, because look, there's what's actually playing out in this family, right? There are these fights and these accusations and this abuse, and who abused whom and who's responsible for the pain. And there's, there's a mood disorder in the mix and there are all these family dynamics.

And all of this is objectively tragic and painful, but then there's also the lens through which our friend here sees all of that and goes, this is really tough to watch, and I don't know how much longer I can stand by and watch this without doing something about it.

[00:54:56] Jordan Harbinger: Right? And even if we don't know exactly how that lens developed, that stuff is clearly there.

He's bringing in his own thoughts, feelings, experiences, beliefs to this situation as well.

[00:55:06] Gabriel Mizrahi: Part of his work is to explore those thoughts and feelings and beliefs so he can know what to do here. For example, he might have an unconscious need to resolve the wounds in this family because I don't know, they echo certain ones in his own family, or because it just feels gratifying to him to play that role, but that doesn't mean he should, or there's another possibility to go back once again to that MV piece.

It might be so distressing to him to watch a mother figure cater to her son in this way. He has the impulse to intervene and tell her to stop. You know, not necessarily because she should, but because it's kind of offensive and uncomfortable to him, or, I don't know. He might want to intervene because it's distressing to him to watch his girlfriend suffer and not know how to do her own work around this.

I'm grasping at a few theories here. It's up to you to decide if these actually fit, but you see what I'm getting at.

[00:55:55] Jordan Harbinger: I do. Until he appreciates what he's bringing to all this, he might march into a situation that isn't entirely his to resolve or he might get in there and get confused. But all that said, it might be acceptable for you to talk to your girlfriend's brother, especially if you guys have a relationship of your own.

I would just be very thoughtful about what your agenda is there, what you're hoping to accomplish, why you want to talk to him. If you're hoping to tell him to forgive his mom or stay away from his dad or bring less to your girlfriend or start taking more responsibility for his life, or whatever it is, even if some of those are good ideas, I would definitely, I would just resist that urge.

I think your best bet to start, and also the respectful and healthy thing to do, is to just invite your girlfriend's brother to talk about how he's feeling these days, what he's struggling with, what he thinks the answers are, what he needs from you right now, and just go from there. If he lets you in, if he seems stable, if he seems receptive, then maybe you can slowly start to offer some thoughts on how to repair things with his family, how to take better care of himself, how to ease some of this chaos and pain that he's creating.

If he doesn't wanna engage with you though, then just, I would back off,

[00:57:06] Gabriel Mizrahi: and even if he is receptive, he's still gonna have to repair things himself. So none of this changes the fact that ultimately, this is not your family. This is not your brother. And this is gonna be a hard system for you alone to heal.

[00:57:17] Jordan Harbinger: Agreed. So we're back to those boundaries again. That timeless principle of this is mine, this is theirs, and let me make sure I'm not all up in someone else's business. I am sorry that you and your girlfriend are going through this. I really am. I understand why all of this is so maddening and disturbing, especially when this family doesn't have the tools to work through things seemingly.

If you can offer them some of those tools appropriately, then that's great, but one tool you might be looking for is knowing when to get involved in other people's work and how much and why sending you good thoughts and good luck. Alright, recommendation of the week.

[00:57:52] Clip Filler: I am addicted to lit filler.

[00:57:54] Gabriel Mizrahi: My recommendation of the week is an acupressure mat, so if you've never heard of these things, it's basically like a mat and a pillow with these sharp, spiky things on them and they dig into your skin and it hurts like hell for a minute or two, and then it feels amazing.

My friend lent me his, it changed my life. Really? Yeah, it's awesome. It's a really nice way to end a workday, to end a work. When you get home from a workout, sometimes I lie on it after a day of writing and I'll just do it for 10 minutes and it's just like you wake up, you just stand up and you're refreshed and you feel great and kind of alert.

It's really cool. It can also be a replacement for naps. If you get tired in the afternoon, just lie on this thing for five or 10 minutes and it'll just kinda like bring you back to life. I read up on it and um, they are proven to relieve stress, pain, anxiety. Some people say they improve sleep. I haven't noticed that benefit myself, but there's definitely something going on with like increasing your energy levels.

I think it triggers the release of endorphins and it somehow influences your sympathetic, parasympathetic nervous system activity somehow. But okay, yeah, give it a go for yourself and see, not everybody loves them. It's kind of uncomfortable. You have to get used to it, but I am such a convert. I love this thing.

The one I have is called the Prma Eco, which is one of the higher end ones, but I'm also gonna link to two other models. There's a mid-range one, and then there's like a very affordable one. I haven't tried those other ones myself, but I wanted to give you guys a few options just in case you want to give one a try and see if you like it before you invest in a really nice one.

This thing is an amazing addition to the home. It's also a great gift for people. So hope you enjoy it, huh?

[00:59:27] Jordan Harbinger: Yeah, it sounds like a bed of nails.

[00:59:29] Gabriel Mizrahi: It basically is, but expensive. It's like these little plastic spikes. Yeah. And they dig into your skin and then you, for like an hour afterwards, you have little marks on your skin and then they go away.

Huh. But once you settle in and you just let it like dig into your scalp, it's like getting a massage without having to do anything. That's interesting.

[00:59:44] Jordan Harbinger: I feel like I've seen these, but I just never really got it. Alright, y'all, in case you didn't know, there's a subreddit for our show. If you wanna jump into discussions with other listeners about specific episodes, if there was an episode you really liked, an episode you really didn't like, you wanna complain about your prana met acupressure thing, poking holes in you, and you want Gabe to see it, you can go to earth.

The subreddit reddit.com/r/jordan harbinger. It's just the Jordan Harbinger subreddit. It's a lot of fun. There's a lot. There's a meme thread, which is hilarious. All right, next up. Hi Jordan

[01:00:13] Gabriel Mizrahi: and Gabe. I have two teenage children. One is a freshman in college, the other is a junior in high school. My wife and I have set aside funds to pay for hopefully all of their college expenses.

This includes tuition, room and board, books, food, et cetera. But now I'm wondering what happens if one of them goes to an inexpensive college and the other goes to an expensive one? Is it fair to the one who goes to the less expensive college if more of the funds help the other child? I think I would feel bad if three quarters of the funds were used to help the child go to the expensive college while the other child only uses a quarter of the funds, even if they would both be getting their college expenses covered.

The one who's already in college is in a relatively inexpensive one. If my other child has the choice between an inexpensive college and an expensive one, should we ask them to factor this in? How would you guys handle this? Signed evening out the scales as my children set sail.

[01:01:06] Jordan Harbinger: Interesting question. So first off, well done on planning ahead for your kids' education.

That is awesome. And it says a lot about how much thought and care you're putting into their futures. I also commend you for getting out ahead of this and wrestling with this question now, rather than letting it become a source of resentment or conflict later on down the line. So it's interesting, I could look at this two different ways.

One way to look at this is the breakdown of the college fund doesn't matter as much as the experience your kids are getting, how you're supporting them in a way that uniquely helps them thrive. So for example, if one kid goes to Dartmouth or whatever, some famously expensive school and the other kid goes to a state school, generally way cheaper.

But those are the schools they wanted to go to. Those are the schools that reflect their abilities and goals in life, and they're equally invested in each other's success, which I would hope they are. Then you could set the tone for this decision, like, Hey, the college fund is one big pool for both of you.

I want you to go to the school, you wanna go to the most, the one that's gonna set you up best for the things you wanna do in life. If one of the schools is more expensive than the other, then let's all agree that that's how it played out and we're not gonna fight over who got more. I'm inviting us all to be grateful that we have the funds to pay for two educations, whatever they cost, which is a gift.

I'm not saying that that's gonna guarantee there won't be some resentment down the line, but it would set a tone and certain values around this college fund that should help. The other way to look at this is the way that you're laying out, which is that the breakdown does matter and it is unfair for one child to use, I don't know, 75% of the college fund, and the other one only uses 25%.

Although I would still hope that your kids are more grateful to be able to afford college in the first place than they are determined to split it exactly 50 50. So here's an idea. What if instead of thinking about this as a college fund, you thought of it as an education fund, and then it's up to your kids to decide how they want to use their half of it.

If one child uses their full 50% on college, great. If they end up using less than their share on tuition and they have some leftover, maybe they can use it for something else. Grad school, career coaching, job training, traveling therapy, whatever you guys deem educational or they save it, they invest it, that money's theirs, and then all this would be totally fair and you'd be giving your kids even more agency in all of this.

[01:03:15] Gabriel Mizrahi: I like that. It would also be inviting them to think about how they want to invest in themselves, which is always a good idea.

[01:03:19] Jordan Harbinger: Exactly. Which I'm personally a big fan of. I realized that it might be a little late to introduce these rules now that one of your kids is already in college. But I don't know, maybe it's still fair game.

It is your money. My only other thought is when you talk to your kids about this, make it a conversation. Invite them to offer their 2 cents. Encourage them to tell you how they think about this money. Maybe even ask your kids, Hey, if one of you ends up going to a more expensive school or a less expensive school, how would you feel about that?

Would you feel cheated or would you be supportive? And then talk about it openly. The more you put on the table now, the better. That's another way to avoid any hard feelings down the line. And if they're like, actually, yeah, I would feel kind of cheated, then you can either encourage them to focus on the value of the education they're getting, which by the way includes what they do with that education, not just how much it costs, or you can say, alright, I hear that.

So how would you feel about this education fund idea where you split it 50 50 and you get to decide how you want to allocate it, and then you guys can talk about that. Ultimately, yeah, I'm not sure there's one right answer here. I think your kids' values, personalities, goals, worldviews, those matter a lot, but personally, I'm a fan of the education fund idea because it's both fair on a dollars and cents level, and it empowers your children even more.

As long as you approach this conversation with fairness, curiosity, gratitude, love, they'll feel that they'll follow your lead, and I think that they'll appreciate this massive gift that you're giving them and good luck. Go back and check out our Gene Simmons interview and our skeptical Sunday on troubled teens.

If you haven't done so yet, the best things that have happened in my life in business have come through my network, the circle of people that I know, like and trust, and I'm teaching you how to build the same thing for yourself. It's our six minute networking course. It is a hundred percent free. I don't need your credit card.

Nothing like that. It's not gross. It is not schmoozey. You can find it on the Thinkific platform@sixminutenetworking.com. It really just takes a few minutes a day. One of the things, it's funny, I always have to answer these messages and people are like, I wish I'd started this earlier. Yeah, dig the well before you get thirsty.

Build relationships before you need them. There's really no replacement for that. You can find it@sixminutenetworking.com. Show notes and transcripts on the website, advertisers, deals, discounts, ways to support the show all at Jordan harbinger.com/deals. I'm at Jordan Harbinger on Twitter and Instagram.

You can also connect with us on LinkedIn Gabe's over on Instagram at Gabriel Mizrahi or on Twitter at Gabe Mizrahi. This show is created in association with Podcast one. My team is Jen Harbinger, Jace Sanderson, Robert Fogarty, and of course, Gabriel Rahi. Our advice and opinions are our own, and I am a lawyer, but I am not your lawyer.

Do your own research before implementing anything you hear on the show. Remember, we rise by lifting others. Share the show with those you love. And if you found the episode useful, please share it with somebody else who could use the advice we gave here today. In the meantime, I hope you apply what you hear on the show so you can live what you learn, and we'll see you next time.

Discover how withholding bathroom breaks can be a strategic negotiation tactic. Why everyone should try entrepreneurship at least once and when it's acceptable to burn bridges.

[01:06:17] Todd McFarlane: I left Marvel, remember the straw that broke the camel's back? We started Image Comic book. I had to create my own character, my own comic book.

I pulled out this character called Spawn. Somebody I created when I was a kid, when I was 16. Spawn comes out, ends up setting a record for the most sales ever by a creator that is non-corporate. And I've never drawn a page for Marvel or DC since I think there are thousands that are way, way, way, way, way better than me.

I don't say that humbly. I say that as a fact, but there's another piece to it. Then there's the hustle, and I am relentless on that part. What I'm not ever trying to do is slay the giant. I'm never gonna do it. I'm not big enough. I don't have enough resources to do it. That's not the goal. The goal is to survive amongst the giants and to thrive amongst the giants.

And then you get to ask sort of the ironic question, why can't the giant kill me? They've got nothing but time and effort and money and resources and they can't squash me. And then in the toy business, I've got a toy business. I go up against the Hasbros and Mattels of the world, and those are Fortune 500 companies.

I literally am at War against Giants every day in my life. I either accept what's in front of me or I go and change it. If you're successful at art, then the byproduct of that is cash. Cash to me is sort of, should be sort of the last thing in the equation.

[01:07:46] Jordan Harbinger: Dive deeper into these intriguing topics and more in episode 9 99 of the Jordan Harbinger Show with Todd McFarland.