98: How to Make Sure You’re Not That Toxic Person | Feedback Friday

Transcript for How to Make Sure You’re Not That Toxic Person | Feedback Friday (Episode 98)

Jordan Harbinger: [00:00:00] Welcome to Feedback Friday, I'm your host, Jordan Harbinger. And I'm here with producer, Jason DeFillippo. I'm literally here. I'm standing in front of you for the first time. I don't think we've ever done one of these live.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:00:08] No, no. I did one with Jason Sanderson last time he was here. But you are still in San Jose.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:00:14] That's all right. So I'm here, and I'm here in your garage and--

Jason DeFillippo: [00:00:18] We're doing the Marc Maron thing.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:00:19] That's right, that's right. And here on the Jordan Harbinger Show, we love having conversations with our fascinating guests and this week we had Jane McGonigal talking about gamification, gamifying your life, how games and gamified thinking can help us recover from injuries, depression. That was a great episode honestly, there was so many practicals in there. She was a great conversationalist. I just, I loved it. We also had Vince Beiser talking about sand,

Jason DeFillippo: [00:00:45] Sand.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:00:45] But you know--

Jason DeFillippo: [00:00:46] Sand.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:00:47] How sand is responsible for civilization as we know it. Heavy sand stuff,

Jason DeFillippo: [00:00:51] Glass and you know, the things that basically make the world go round.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:00:54] Of course, our primary mission is to pass along the guests and our experiences and wisdom and insights along the you. In other words, the real purpose of this show is to have conversations directly with you and that's what we're going to do today here on Feedback Friday. You can reach us friday@jordanharbinger.com. If you can keep them concise, which all of you have been doing awesome with lately by the way. That does really increase the chance that your question will get answered on the air. And I'm getting hungry, Jason, so I'm going to skip some of the Jibba Jabba and go straight to the mailbag. What do you think?

Jason DeFillippo: [00:01:24] It's national cheeseburger day, so let's get to it.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:01:26] All right.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:01:26] Hey, Jason and Jordan. I'm a 22 year old recent college graduate. I finished an internship with sway in the morning at SiriusXM over the summer. Everyone was amazing and I loved every minute of it, because I'm a broadcast major. I'm currently looking for a job, but would love to keep in touch with the crew and even maybe be mentored by them as well, which I knew you've talked about multiple times. How would you go about this? I have their personal contacts but I'm not sure how to use them properly. Also, what would you do right now if you were in my shoes? I have three podcasts, edit them all including video. I do blog posts and more. Is there anything else I can be doing besides waiting patiently? With Great Contacts Comes Great Responsibility.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:02:06] Ah! I see what you did there. So first things first, I do talk, don't get me to start on the mentorship thing. We talked about this a lot. Don't ask to be mentored. I get what you're saying here, but don't write to them and be like mentor me for reasons that I've covered in videos on my Instagram if you find me @jordanharbinger, you can hear that rant if you are interested. First things first though, add value by asking what those people want and need. Ask them about the process for getting a job and what might make you more competitive without actually bugging them for the job itself at first, and if they're not hiring you, if they won't hire you, ask them how you can be better. The trick would be to have framed this and hopefully done this during the internship, but this didn't happen. That's fine. It's not too late. Come to the table with ideas and what ideas I'm thinking of here are, instead of saying, “Hey, can I have a job? What do I need to get a job?” You might want to come with them and say, “Hey, I've an idea, for swing in the morning.” Why don't I record him with my DSLR camera or my iPhone or whatever, doing his morning guest intro and then post that little video on his Instagram story on the Instagram, on the YouTube channel. I'll take care of this. I'll tag it up. I'll tag the guest, I'll tag everybody else, do the clips. That way you've got some social plans. You've got some value that you're bringing to the table. You've gained the whole thing out. This is called the briefcase technique. You're bringing that whole idea to the show, to the host, to the producer. You're making their job easier in, you're coming in with a concrete game plan. Most people will come in and say, “Hey, I liked working there. Can I work there?” Instead of that say, “I'd love to work there. Here's the idea that I will execute when you hire me.” And you outline the entire project, they can see what value that has for them and I think that's a much better way to stand out among the other interns, a way to get hired by them that shows them this is what's going to happen, if we pulled the trigger on hiring this guy. And I would follow up kind of religiously maybe every other week. Use tools like text, use email, and if you do use email use tools like boomerang for Gmail to make sure that if they don't respond, it boomerangs back to your inbox and you can follow up on it. That shows that you're professional and that you're organized instead of just emailing them once and going, “Well, never heard back, not sure what's going to happen, or emailing them every week and then forgetting that they replied and said, “Circle back in a month.” Keep the thread alive using tools like boomerang, and best of luck. I think with the briefcase technique and having gained this out with a little bit of polite persistence. You're a shoe in for this kind of gig. All right, next up.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:04:34] Hey guys, I'm a 35 year old woman from Detroit. I'm LGBT, and also have a rare adrenal deficiency that's life threatening. I once cold reached Jordan via Facebook but didn't realize it was his personal page. Last year when you all were with the other show, Jordan messaged me asking if we met at some point as my name wasn't catching his memory. We had a few messages back and forth of which I seem to start to annoying him. Yeah, that's easy to annoy Jordan sometimes. Yeah, here's the thing. This is not the issue, not Jordan at least. The issue is with me, I often fail in social situations. I tend to make things awkward. My tone can be taken badly and I've been told I'm intimidating, extreme, et cetera. I was on History Channel is Forged in Fire Season Four. I did well enough to make it to the finals with a heartbreaking ending.

[00:05:19] The decisions I made on the show wound up making me Forged in Fire famous. People still joke about the big mistake in the show groups and knife making groups. I do enjoy the jokes though. So how do I work on being less awkward in social situations? How can I capitalize on my time with the show? And finally, how can I aim to become someone that is a face of the LGBT community and to others with my deficiency as someone who defies many of the odds that tend to hold us back from chasing our dreams. Feedback Friday is my favorite weekly podcast. Keep it up. Signed, Forged And Frustrated.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:05:51] Nice. So this one had me spinning for a few. I actually went and checked our message history and I see anything awkward at all. I didn't see anything where I got annoyed. I didn't see anything awkward on her part and nothing. So this sort of indicates to me that maybe a lot of this exists in her head, maybe she's ruminating a lot, beating herself up a lot, going over what she said and thinking, “Oh, this must have,” doing that mind reading thing. This person must have thought this based on what I said and now they're annoyed at me and it's just not true. It's one of those cognitive fallacies that leads to depression and other things like that. We talked about this on the show before as well.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:06:26] Yeah, I know we've both had that before. You know when you have an idea in your head what you're projecting to that person with that projection is in their head and it comes back and said the whole mindreading thing that just never works right.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:06:38] Right. Exactly, exactly. So I don't know what happened on Forged in Fire though I'm super curious now to try and find that. I'm tempted to look that up as well. The rumination, the mind reading, trying to figure out what other people think and assuming that you know what that is, it makes for awkwardness and people who focus on their discomfort make others uncomfortable. So if you're focused on how uncomfortable you are, you will make other people uncomfortable because they will start to mirror your nonverbal communication. So if you're feeling awkward inside, it manifests in your nonverbal communication in your external state outside which other people read and then pick up on. And then before you know it, they're like, “I don't know, there's something weird about him,” or “There's something weird about her.” So it's not something you're lacking per se that's making other people feel weird around you, as far as capitalizing on your time on the show or becoming an ambassador for your community that is more of a grass roots thing. I'm not really clear as to what you're looking to do, but it sounds like you want to be a face of a particular disease in a community and the adrenal thing that particular condition or disease. And whenever people ask me this type of question, the response I have is always to ask what value are you adding to that community? For example, if you want to brand yourself as the face of a particular issue, you'll have to ask yourself what you're doing to be valuable to the people who have that issue. What makes you a leader in that space? You know, what are you doing for those people and for them? So I feel like you answered that question and the path starts to make itself a bit more clear. Best of luck. And don't be so hard on yourself, girl. I feel like you're beating yourself up a lot. You're trying to read into other people's minds and intentions and it's really, it's a losing battle. You can never win that. So take it easy and focus on adding value to the community. And before you know it, you'll be that leader and that ambassador that you want to be.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:08:22] And to kind of roll back to one of the episodes of this week with Jane McGonigal. I've been using the hands up technique to just be open when I'm listening to other people. So I'm not so you know, nervous. I'm kind of like her. I can be aggressive and you know this, I can be intimidating.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:08:41]Yep. Oh wait, that wasn’t what I thought you were going to say.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:08:45] No, no, no. It's okay. But going listen to the Jane McGonigal episode and use that hands up techniques sometime just to chill out before you go into an interaction. And I found that slows me down a little bit now, and if I'm definitely talking to somebody where I have to have like a discussion of back and forth, I can understand their position a little bit better.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:09:03] I like that. So who knows? Who knew? That actually works. All right, next up.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:09:07] Hey Jordan, big fan. I've heard a lot lately about avoiding toxic people. My question is, what if the toxic person is me? I've been told I'm thin skinned and project my emotions. Looking for solutions. Cheers, Toxic And Confused.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:09:22] Did you write that Jason? You can tell me.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:09:24] No, I did not write this one, but I could have, I completely could have, you know, I'm the toxic guy in the room.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:09:30] First though, props to you for admitting this might be the case. I think a lot of people are like, it's everyone else. It's not me. Everyone else is a total jerk and life sucks, but it's not me though, it's them. I think it's a huge step towards fixing the issue to admit that this might be the case, that you might be the toxic one. Do you find yourself emotionally reactive to other people? It sounds like it. I totally get being thin skinned and projecting to, it happens. The question is, do you know the cause? And grab some therapy, grab a therapist that you trust, get to the cause and attack the roots of the cause, the root of the issue, despite what grandpas and parents all over the world might say, “You can't just decide to get a thicker skin” or to, you know, “Man up and deal with it.” That's not really a choice that you can make in a moment.

[00:10:17] You really do need to figure out why you're reacting to others? Why are you sensitive? What's triggering you? I hate to overuse that word, but you know, it's in our vocab now. It's not because of them, it's because of something that happened to you or a pattern of behavior from your past that's creeping up and causing this. And usually when we take things out on others, it's because we're actually being really hard on ourselves already. So that's a topic best explored with a therapist, and I guarantee that once you start digging in this area, you'll start to feel a lot better, even early on, you're doing something to get it handled. I think a lot of people who are hard on others who are really thin skinned, really sensitive, the reason they're sensitive is because they spend a lot of time beating up themselves and so that skin is already been tenderized by themselves.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:11:02] I totally agree with that. That was me in my 20s, you know?

Jordan Harbinger: [00:11:05] Yep.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:11:05] Absolutely. And it stuck into my 30s, but now that I'm in my 40s, and become a wizened old man, I can still see this though and it comes down to me, at least for ego. I always just like everybody was attacking me. If something was wrong, I didn't see the world right. And once you start to figure out that, well, for me it was, I'm not the most important person in the room, then I really didn't become the focus of the attention and I could let other people talk and it would then let me learn from other people as well, because what being the toxic person in the room did was shut everybody down and nobody wanted to talk to me. And once I got past that, then I could actually have deep conversations with people, but it comes down to just being vulnerable, and I hate that word.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:11:50] Yeah, it is overused.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:11:51] It is overused.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:11:52] If you're not doing it wrong, it was fine.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:11:53] Yeah. You got to do it right. Goes into our Deep Dive on vulnerabilities, so learn how to do it right.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:11:57] From last week.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:11:57] Exactly. And once you get to that point and you can like have deep conversations with people, I think that toxicity goes away.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:12:04] Yeah, I would agree. I think that's largely what it is. It's not from the sound of it, you don't have all these negative habits. You're not encouraging people to like go do a bunch of drugs and stay out all night. You just have a crappy mindset because you've been beating yourself up a lot, most likely. And you're projecting that sort of judgment that you have of yourself onto others, which is really unfair. You're acting like they've already done something to you when they haven't, and that's a habit you got to break. So best of luck and keep in touch.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:12:32] This is Feedback Friday. We'll be right back after this.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:12:35] This episode is sponsored in part by Varidesk. I've love my Varidesk. This thing is the desk of the future, future, future. It's really cool. It took me a while to get around to assembling it and then when I did, it took like five minutes. So it was one of those, “Oh, I don't want to do this. I don't want to do this,” and then it was like, “Oh, that was, that's it? That's so easy.” The Varidesk ProDesk 60 Electric is a tank. It's a beautiful tank, but it really makes it easy to create an active workspace. Sometimes I'm standing, sometimes I'm sitting, and it's designed with commercial grade materials, so it's durable, it's stable. Like I said, assemble the thing and under five minutes and it's built to last. Once you build it, you can actually move it, and I'm telling you with furniture, a lot of times that ain't the case. You build it and the thing can't go anywhere. This thing is office quality and it's a staple in my home office now. You can try this risk-free for 30 days with free shipping and free returns. If you're not satisfied, just go to varidesk.com/jordan. That's V-A-R-I-D-E-S-K.com/jordan.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:13:36] This episode is sponsored in part by Wrangler. Everybody has a favorite pair of jeans. The pair that fits perfectly and always looks great. The pair you wear out at night, at home on the couch, at work, wherever. They're the go to, do not underestimate their importance. No one knows this better than Wrangler. The authority on jeans using their expertise and comfort and durability, Wrangler jeans are made for the adventurers, the go getters, folks who like to keep moving, whether you ride a bike, a bronc, or a skateboard, or if you're the type that walks the Earth in search of something, these are the jeans for you. Classic or modern styles, a range of fits at a price that works for you. Vintage rereleases, Wrangler has something for everyone. Visit wrangler.com and check out their great selection of jeans, shirts, pants, outerwear for men and women. New styles, great fits. Wrangler, real comfortable jeans.

[00:14:22] Thanks for listening in supporting the show. To learn more about our sponsors and get links to all the great discounts you just heard, visit jordanharbinger.com/advertisers, and if you'd be so kind, please drop us a nice rating and review on iTunes or your podcast player of choice. It really helps us out and helps build the show family. If you want some tips on how to do that, then just head on over to jordanharbinger.com/subscribe. Now, let's hear some more of your questions here on Feedback Friday in my extremely warm garage.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:14:49] Next up.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:14:50] Greetings, Jordan, Jason, and Jen. This is a $70,000 question I don't know the answer too and have trust in your opinion and experience. This question is about law school. My entire life, relatives, teachers, friends, and recently my significant other claim I would make a great lawyer though I'm doubtful. After college I took a job at a corporate law firm to find out what the heck a lawyer does, and that's a good way to know.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:15:15] Good question. Yeah, I think that's bravo for you actually looking to do that.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:15:19] Over the last few years, I've understood how valuable learning to think like an attorney can be. I was also promoted to a position I essentially created to challenge myself daily and still have time for my long running side projects and business. Recently, my significant other who has an engineering degree from an Ivy league school has bristled in my longtime introduction at functions leading with my side hustle. At work, I'm a researcher, IT, and paralegal in a professional gamer and business owner off the hours on my side hustle. She's always teased me about having so much potential and would bring up how her best friends are lawyers, but recently my boss has been mentioning law school to me too, and the firm doesn't offer tuition assistance or guarantee an associate position after graduation, so that's kind of a bummer.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:16:03] Yeah.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:16:03] I may be have potential, but I rarely showed up to class for undergrad and as a stakeholder in a business, my team is still running and growing. My side hustle was how I paid for my bachelors and a new car without touching my savings. I'm pretty close to the life that I've dreamed of. Congrats. But the person I've grown to love, respect, and want to share it with seems so much more distant because I have a hard time going into debt and back to school. I'm a practical and driven person, so I can accept that I'm just afraid of failing. But the alternative is giving up a career that already offers autonomy, solid pay, benefits, and rewarding challenges. Along with time to pursue supplemental income for traveling around the world to compete, speak at panels and have freedom to do things she enjoys doing. The friction seems only to come when going to a young professionals function or a couples dinner. We communicate well and match values for most things, except for getting an advanced degree. Is a piece of paper really that valuable? Any insights are very appreciated. Sincerely, Sensible Or Still Acting My Shoe Size.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:17:06] So here's the problem here. A lot of people who tell you should be a lawyer, they're not lawyers. They have no clue what makes a good lawyer. They say things like, “Oh yeah, you should become a lawyer because you like to argue.” “You should be a lawyer because you're organized.” “You should be a lawyer because whatever.” They don't know. They don't know what being a lawyer is like, and most people don't when they go to law school. So he did the right thing. He got an internship at a corporate law firm to see the reality and then he didn't like what he saw. So that should answer the question.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:17:36] Yeah, seriously.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:17:37] That answers that right there. If you don't feel called to that reality, you got to trust your gut. It's not even your gut. You have experience and you said, “No, I don't like this.”

Jason DeFillippo: [00:17:45] It wasn't like a couple of months. It was like he's been there over a year, so he's definitely seen the sausage is made, and he's not a fan.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:17:51] Not a fan. So that's not going to change just because you have a piece of paper on the wall. This is her issue really. It's not yours, man. I know that sucks to hear because this is somebody that you love, but she's embarrassed because she values the paper and the credentials, but it says a lot more about her than it does about you. She's embarrassed because you're telling people at professional functions that you've got a side hustle, that you're a gamer, that you've got your side business and that you're also a researcher. That's embarrassing for her, but not for you. That's a problem, because your designing the type of life that you want, you said so yourself. You should be proud of that, it seems like she's not proud of that.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:18:27] You know he's a gamer, right there, she's got an advanced engineering degree and he’s a gamer. This is my boyfriend, a gamer.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:18:33] Yeah, I get it. I get how that looks. I get how that feels for her, but I also get that she shouldn't be saying, “Hey, can you ruin your entire life so that I feel a little bit less awkward about introducing you to other people.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:18:46] Yeah, yeah. It seems like just such a weird trade off because this guy obviously paid for his career already. He got his degree and he's making money and can still travel the world and do the things that he wants to do. But when they go to dinner or manufactured function, she's a little awkward. Seems kind of--

Jordan Harbinger: [00:19:05] Self-centered much.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:19:06] A little petty.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:19:07]Yeah. A little petty, and here's the other thing, in five or 10 years at the latest, after you get your law degree and all your friends get that law degree, or you don't get that law degree, but all these other people get a law degree, guess who's going to be like, “Yo man! You've got it all figured out.” “You're a gamer. Ah, I wish I'd done something cool like that.” Right now it seems like a big deal, but you could go through law school like I did and then I left after a year, started doing the podcast with Jason, started the business up, got everything going. Nobody who I went to law school with is like, “Dude, you made a huge mistake designing this kickass life.” They're all out of law, almost all of them, and the ones that aren't, they still like what I'm doing. So trust me, you are on the right path right now, and you've got to talk to her frankly about this. If she can't get over this, this is going to affect your relationship, but you are under no obligation to make yourself miserable and dive into a career you hate, just so your significant other can have bragging rights because that's what this is.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:20:03] Yeah, yeah. It's just so she can feel better in a dinner.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:20:06] At a fricking function once a month. It wouldn't surprise me also, if she's gotten outside pressure from her family and friends like “You're dating this guy, he's going nowhere He's wasting his potential. He's got this business. Games, there's no money in it.” I mean all of these things are not true by the way anymore.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:20:21] Not true at all. Especially look at the gaming industry right now, it’s bigger than the movie industry. And he's a professional gamer who is making a living at it. That's awesome!

Jordan Harbinger: [00:20:29] My buddy Mick, who's a really well-known DJ, he sent me a picture. He's like, “This is what I'm doing right now.” We are chatting online, on texting, whatever. And I was like, “Where are you?” And it was like the Philadelphia versus the Taiwan team of Overwatch or something.

It was like the championship in Brooklyn. And I went, “How many people are there?” And he goes, “I don't know, like 20,000.” I was like, “Wait a minute.” 20,000 people are packing into a Brooklyn Stadium to watch Taiwan versus, I think Philadelphia played this video game, and they're going bananas. There's money in this man.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:21:03] Oh yeah.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:21:04] By the way, if you become a lawyer, I hope you don't expect anybody to gather an arena and cheer for you. That's not going to happen.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:21:09] Not going to happen.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:21:10] Not going to happen. Not unless you're getting dragged behind a horse, then maybe you know, then they'll cheer for a lawyer. But values diverge, you might have to choose between your happy life and the life of your design and your relationship, but you should never get rid of what makes you happy and content to make someone else happy for a superficial reason, like what she's got going.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:21:29] Yeah, totally agree. So yeah, keep on gaming, dude.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:21:32] Yeah, keep on game, man. It's not like you live in your parents' basement and you're dependent on everyone else for money and you're a gamer. He's already making money.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:21:41] Yeah, he paid for his college with it.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:21:43] Right. So he's beyond the whole like, “I'm going to be a rapper,” and he's like a 30 year old white guy. He's already doing it. So I don't think these people are right at all. Keep on gaming, keep in touch, and sorry that you're caught between the situation, but I think whatever shakes out in the future, either she accepts you or you guys end up going your separate ways, you're going to be better off for it.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:22:06] We'll be right back with more Feedback Friday right after this.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:22:09] This episode is also sponsored by HostGator. Listen, we talk a lot about effective networking and relationship building on this show. Anyone who's been listening for a while understands the basics of connecting with and being a value to, people who help us become better at who we are and what we do, but it's hard to get traction when your new connections look for you online and they see you don't even have a website. I'll admit, I'm a little judgy with that myself and you know worse maybe the only mention of you online is from some troll who's got a bone to pick with you or with your business. Why should that troll have control over your reputation when HostGator can have your website up and running today with you in the driver's seat? No experience with code necessary. If you can use a web browser, you can build your own website, no fuss, no muss. That's why we recommend HostGator's Website Builder. HostGator has a hundred plus mobile friendly templates, so it's going to look good on a tablet, phone, computer, you want WordPress one click, add-ons couple clicks, like PayPal so people can buy directly from your website. SEO plugins to help you show up higher and search, and 99.9 percent up time. Great tech support, 24/7, 365, and it's not going to break the bank. HostGator's given our wonderful listeners up to 62 percent off all packages for new users with a 45 day complete money back guarantee and you get unlimited email addresses based from your website. Most places don't offer that, so you ended up getting upsold because you want to have one for yourself and one for your assistant, et cetera. Go to hostgator.com/jordan right now to sign up. That's hostgator.com/jordan, and thanks for supporting our sponsors that support the show.

[00:23:43] I also want to bump an event called, We Are Podcast. It is in Australia. I'll be speaking at, We Are Podcast 2018, the 18th to the 20th of October. We Are Podcast exists to essentially help people leverage the power of audio marketing craft of podcast, enable an existing one to flourish. It's a really fun conference. I've been there. This'll be my third year in a row I want to say, and I love Australia. I love meeting show fans in Australia. I love that We Are Podcast crew down there in Australia. It'll help you amplify your message to reach newer wider audiences and it's a great way to learn from some really great thinkers and doers down in Australia and from around the world frankly. I mean, like I said, I'm flying all the way there from California, and We Are Podcast will help give you the tools to make your new mission a reality here.

[00:24:30] I'm going to be talking about starting from scratch and regrowing the show audience that I did when we had to unplug it and plug it back in again earlier this year. So I'm going to be talking a lot about that. So come say hi. We'll be having a final hurrah speaker sale for We Are Podcast 2018 tickets. It's a three day sale from the 21st to the 23rd of September for both virtual tickets and in person conference tickets. Anyone who uses the code, I Know A Speaker will get 25 percent off. The code is I Know A Speaker, and you can get that from the 21st to the 23rd of September 2018 at wearepodcast.com/2018. It'd be great to see some of you there if you get a chance to make it down.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:25:13] Thanks for listening and supporting the show. Your support of our advertisers is what keeps us on the air. To learn more and get links to all the great discounts you just heard, visit jordanharbinger.com/advertisers, and we also have an Alexa Skills so you can get inspirational and educational clips from the show in your daily briefing. Go to jordanharbinger.com/alexa, or search for Jordan Harbinger in the Alexa App. Back to the show for the conclusion of Feedback Fridays, so we can go get some hamburgers.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:25:40] All right, next up.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:25:41] Hi Jordan and Jason. I absolutely love your show. I'm a 30 year old listener from Rwanda.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:25:46] Wow.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:25:47] I speak French and English in addition to my native local language and hold a public health degree. I have a satisfying in high paying job for where I am. My issue is I'm a gay man living in Rwanda.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:25:58] Damn!

Jason DeFillippo: [00:25:59] Homosexuality here is not criminalized, but very stigmatized. Every single straight person I know is absolutely and openly disgusted about even the idea of homosexuality. I fake it with everyone I know, including my family and my closest friends. I'm getting resentful towards my very religious entourage when thinking they won't hesitate to reject me because of how I was born. I want to move to the US or Canada, and live more freely in general, but especially free as a gay person. I visited both countries for about two months and loved it there. I'm aware immigrating even legally presents numerous challenges and I'm scared to death about the idea of starting a new life from scratch. On the other hand, I don't really feel like I have a life or a future here. Am I being too naive to think I'll be more free in those countries? I'm black, so is racism, unemployment in a very different way of life going to be worse than homophobia. Thank you so much for your great work. Signed, Trapped In The Closet.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:26:56] Wow. Rwanda in closet, no less.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:26:58] Yeah, man, that's crazy.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:26:59] That is a doozy. I don't envy your position here. First, bravo to you for being honest with yourself. I think Western values actually are more compatible with what you want out of life. Freedom and the ability to live the way that you like. And yes, a lot of people are racist a-holes around here. I'm sure that's not going to change anytime soon unfortunately, and yes, a lot of people are homophobic. I don't think it's the majority, it's just a loud segment of the population that is dwindling in number, I would imagine. And there are plenty of communities here where you'll fit in, including the mainstream of civilized North Americans and just about any city in the US or Canada. So yeah, come live in the US, come live in Canada. I know the process is a huge pain in the butt and it takes forever, but in my opinion, it sure beats living in a place where you'll have to live in fear of your friends and family, finding out who you really are and ostracizing you if they ever find out. Imagine never being able to tell your closest friends and family who you really are. Never being able to go out and have lunch with your boyfriend, husband, significant other, whatever. That's not freedom, and you deserve to be free. Everybody deserves to be free.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:28:09] Yeah, he's got a terrifying life over there. I mean, he can't have a relationship.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:28:15] No.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:28:15] And that's just, that's a tragedy.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:28:17] So let's outline this. Your best case scenario in this limited dating pool of underground people that you have to meet in possibly dangerous places and you have to worry about the violence and the discrimination in that. Let's say you meet your best possible match. Someone visits your soulmate, you're amazed by them. Everything is perfect. You can never tell any of your friends. You can never get married in a way that's public with all your friends and family there. You can never tell your family. They're never going to accept you. You can never go and go on vacation together. You can't go hang out together in a public place and go see a freaking movie together. You can never do any of that. So that's your best case scenario in Rwanda.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:28:57] That's best case.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:28:58] That sucks.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:28:59] That's terrible.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:29:00] Yeah.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:29:00] Terrible.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:29:01] Your worst case scenario is you come to the US and Canada, and you're single and it's really overwhelming and some people are racist a-holes and some people shout names at you when they find out that you're gay, and then you move on and you go hang out with your seven dozen friends that live in any major city in the US and Canada. You have a huge dating pool and it takes you awhile to find someone because of the paradox of choice. That's probably your worst case scenario here in the US or Canada in North America. So yeah, look, I know the process of migrating is a huge pain, but I think it's better than the alternative for sure.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:29:31] Yeah. I don't think it's a choice. I think it's a must do.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:29:34] It really is. It's just like being a certain religion. I met a guy who was Christian who was from Iran and he fled Iran because he's like, we had to go to church underground and it was a huge pain in the butt and persecution, and you could lose your job if people found out you weren't Muslim, and that's not worth it. That's a good reason to leave a country and if you've got a great job in Rwanda, you can probably find a great job here.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:29:55] Yeah, he's got a degree. It should be a no brainer.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:29:58] Yep. All right, so best of luck and keep in touch. Let us know how it goes, man. I'm curious. All right, next.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:30:04] Hey guys. I've been doing contract work for a large corporation for the past few months and my boss recommended me for a full time position in another department. The manager wanted to hire me, but the last person I interviewed with was a VP who said he wanted me for a position that doesn't yet exist. The VP kept me in the dark for weeks then send an email that said he wanted to talk to me about a long-term arrangement. That email was more than a month ago and I haven't heard anything since. It's hard for me to know what's going on because I work from home. I know I'd like the position I applied for, but I have no idea what the VP has in mind or what's taking him so long. I'm thinking of restarting my job search just in case. Is there a tactful way to get to the bottom of this until the VP, it's time to make up his mind. If I get an offer from another company, should I accept the offer on the condition that I have to give the other company a chance at making a counter offer? Thanks for your help, No Time For Limbo.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:30:57] All right, so I definitely recommend that you start your search now. The best time to find a job is when you already have a job, even if that's just contract work. Again, the best time to find a job is when you already have a job. You have far less leverage and much greater need and desperation when you are, well when you don't have a job, you have no income. You can't poke someone into action unless you have real leverage. Otherwise, you're just bluffing, which can blow up on you. So there's no way for you to go -- there's no way for you to reliably go, “Hey, you should hire me. I've got another offer.” If you don't have one, because they might say, “Oh you should take that. Good. I'm off the hook now.”

Jason DeFillippo: [00:31:35] We talked about that on the last Feedback Friday, right?

Jordan Harbinger: [00:31:37] I think so.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:31:38] Where I actually pulled that trick and I'm like,” Oh I've got another job offer.” But I knew that they were going to keep me, and you can't do that if you have like a family or somebody to support. You have to be careful about that. And I think your friend Neil Strauss said “Never get off the train until the other trains at the station.”

Jordan Harbinger: [00:31:55] Yeah, yeah. That's so wise. Get another offer. So start your job search, get another offer, and if you want, then you can sort of try to leverage that to the VP and say, look, in a very non, not like take it or leave it buddy, but in a way where you say, “Look, I really want to work with you but I've got to take a job. I've got to move on with my life. I've got this other offer on the table. Can you match it?” And if you decide to go with them, with the VP, make sure you get that offer in writing because what you don't want is for him to go, “Yeah, we totally want you.” And then you're like, “Hey, sorry, new company, can't take the job.” And then this VP goes sit tight for another six months while I talked with the board in October. And you're like, “What's the? What are you talking about?” So there's a good chance that you're just out of sight, out of mind. Maybe they're not doing this to you on purpose. Maybe write them an email each week, every 10 days or so. Let them know you're interested in something permanent, but don't hold your breath. It's possible he just doesn't have anything for you and there's no budget and he doesn't have a way to let you know that right now because he's a big wimp and he doesn't want to let you down. But so he's willing to just let you down by making you hold in limbo indefinitely, anything. “So he's fine. He's got contract work, it's all good. He's good.” Maybe he doesn't realize that you need to get something permanent here. Time to poop or get off the pot. So get another gig and you can always come back later if you even still want to work there. It's time to move forward. All right, next up.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:33:18] Hey guys, I'm a 29 year old Australian living in Montreal. I recently changed careers from Aussie government worker to graphic designer to which I started studying a year ago. I returned to Montreal after my previous time here of nine months while I was soul searching, to study and focus on my career, to which I got an awesome graphic design job that I love and that pays well, and I'm still pinching myself. Here's the problem, I'm approaching the time I told my parents and friends I would be returning to Australia, but I don't want to go back just yet. I love it here, and there are so many opportunities in my field more so than the small city I'm from. I feel a lot of pressure from my family to quote unquote make sure I'm coming back. But I feel it would be a step down in my career to return right now. I love my friends and family, but I feel happy in Montreal. Am I being selfish to be living my life on the other side of the world? And how would you best approach this situation to shed the guilt of staying here longer? Thanks team, Awful Or Ambitious Son.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:34:15] So this is not selfish at all. I almost did -- I had to read this a few times because I didn't even see the problem initially.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:34:21] I know.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:34:22] The problem is your mom wants you to go home, your friends miss you. Like, “Wait, where's the problem, problem?”

Jason DeFillippo: [00:34:26] You're happy in a new place. You have a great job that you actually liked doing and you're doing okay. Where's the problem?

Jordan Harbinger: [00:34:32] The problem is you didn't think you'd like it this much. So you said you'd come home in the fall and now you don't want to. I mean what the heck? This is part of growing in, growing up and growing in a job and in a career, them wanting you to come back. That's the selfish part. You're not selfish. They're being selfish, okay? You're the only one who knows what's best for you to grow during this time of your life. Look, they'll miss you, you'll miss them, whatever. That's normal. It's part of life. And nobody says you can't visit or better, what I would do is I would have them come visit you and see why you love the place and why you're so happy. It's going to be hard for your mom to come visit you and see you super happy with all your friends and your great career and then go, “Hey, you know what? We want you to come home and be miserable because I'm important and you're not.”

Jason DeFillippo: [00:35:17] Come back to Mayberry and sit around and do nothing with your life just so I can see you for dinner every night.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:35:22] Right. Yeah, it's ludicrous. Invite them to come visit, stay with you for a while. They'll see your world and that should go a long way to changing their perceptions of your plans, and by all means stay and live and grow. I really can't think of a reason you’d go home if you don't want to and you're on this big upswing in Montreal. This is something that happens to a lot of kids when they leave the nest. Parents handle it differently. My mom was really cool with me moving around in different countries because she lived abroad coincidentally in Australia in 1968 I think, when she was younger. But I had tons of friends whose parents wouldn't even let them spend an entire summer overseas with like a college program where all you're doing is hanging out with other Americans and your chaperone and you're hanging out at a freaking youth hostel or something like that. I mean that's not even a real experience for most people. The resistance here is something they have to learn to deal with. And the best way to help them do that is to let them feel included in your life, and even if you're not planning to actually come home anytime soon. So I would have them come visit, see what your world is like, and I think that should loosen up their expectations a little bit.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:36:26] Yeah, I know, definitely. When I left home at like 24, I left late, and my dad was like, “I don't want you to go but get out there and do the thing you want to do,” because he wanted to see me succeed. And I think that a good family will understand that. So I think once awful or ambitious son tells the parents, I don't think it's going to be bad, I think they're going to be like, “If you're happy son, do what you got to do.”

Jordan Harbinger: [00:36:48] Right. Right now they dismiss you and they're like, “Oh, you said you'd be home,” and your mom's like, “Oh, you're so far away, and Montreal is so dangerous.” I mean they don't, they don't know.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:36:55] It also comes back to mind reading, which we talked at the beginning of the episode where he's putting himself in their place thinking about what they're going to say to him I think, and he might just be saying, “Oh, they want me to come back,” so I have this guilt that I should come back, but they might be thinking, “Get the hell out.”

Jordan Harbinger: [00:37:13] Oh, you said you'd be back soon, and then he's not coming back. Well, we'll miss him, but it sure is nice having the house to ourselves.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:37:19] Yeah. They've already Airbnb his room.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:37:22] Yeah, yeah, there's already somebody else living in your room, dude.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:37:24] Exactly, man.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:37:25] Oh, darn. You're not coming home. Oh no, I hate having this extra income and not having to clean the house up. All right, next step.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:37:33] Hi Jordan. When I was three years old, my mom moved us away from my father due to a serious alcohol and drug addictions as well as his lack of parenting and ability to provide. We moved from Florida to Idaho. Now, I'm 18 and haven't seen him since then. His family told my mom that he may be dying. I've never had much interest in meeting him because he could never get it together for me. Now that I might never have a chance to confront him and at least ask, “What the fuck, dude?” I'm not sure how indifferent I am. I love your show and your advice would be very appreciated. Signed, Estrange And Confused.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:38:05] Wow. Well my opinion is this and I've never experienced anything like this personally of course, but if you can get to him before he dies without serious hardship, you might want to do it just because if he dies and you never visit him, it's possible, you'll have all these unanswered questions. You might be super curious, you might have regrets, then again, maybe not. I would consider going to a therapist just to process the whole experience. I've had a few friends who've had his strange parents die, and it actually hits them a lot harder than they it was going to. One of my friends is like, I don't even know if he ever knew his father and his father died of a heart condition and he just lost it. He just had like a meltdown and we lost track of him for months. It may be get a therapist beforehand, do a session or two, which never hurts anyway. It's always kind of a good way to get some process, some stuff that which we all have, and then go to the same therapist afterwards and do a session or two just to kind of integrate the entire experience. And this will be especially helpful if you learned something disturbing during your visit. Like I tried to see you, but your mom wouldn't let me. It's like, “Oh my God! Can of worms.” Or maybe he'll tear open some old wounds or something or maybe it'll just hit you emotionally in a way that you don't expect and then you've already got a therapist where you can process this in and not just losing sleep over it for three years or 30 years. So in all, in your shoes, I'd be at least curious about the guy, even if my expectations were generally pretty low for the experience itself, I would still want to see what's going on. At the very least, it might put some closure on something unresolved from your childhood.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:39:36] Yeah. When you're talking to that therapist too, I'd like sketch out what questions you want answered, what are you trying to get out of that interaction with your dad? Because if you're just going to say, “Hey dude, why'd you leave?” He might just be, “I was a fuck up.” And then you have no answers. It's just like why and figure out what questions you want answered and what you will do if you get certain answers back. I think working that out with a therapist, like you said is a really good way to kind of like figure out if this interaction is actually going to help you for the rest of your life or harm you for the rest of your life, because I really think that there is a possibility there that it could actually give you answers that you don't want.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:40:17] Right.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:40:18] So Yeah, I totally agree with that idea of seeing a therapist, but get that down on paper and what you want to do before you actually go make that step.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:40:27] Hope you all enjoyed that. I want to thank everyone that wrote in this week. I feel like we had a really good assortment of questions this week. Don't forget, you can email us friday@jordanharbinger.com to get your questions answered on the air. We're happy to keep you anonymous, of course, we always do with that in fact. A link to the show notes for this episode can be found at jordanharbinger.com. Quick shout out to Dentist Connor, who wrote in after going through a really tough time, he got fired by his boss due to greed and not his own greed, his boss’ greed, and land back on his feet. Now he's in a better place, ha! Best revenge is always to live well.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:40:59] Take that!

Jordan Harbinger: [00:40:59] That's right. And to Kyle and his girlfriend, Sonia, she introduced the Jordan Harbinger Show to Kyle to keep up with some soft skills, learned some soft skills. Hey Kyle and Sonia, I'm on Instagram and Twitter @jordanharbinger. It's a great way to engage with the show. And Jason, where can they find you?

Jason DeFillippo: [00:41:14] You can find the links to all my socials @jpd.me, and you can check out my other podcast, Grumpy Old Geeks. For more info on that show, just go to gog.show and if you go to Jordan's Instagram, I think you can see some video that Jen may have just posted of us doing the show right now.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:41:28] That's right, that's right.

Jason DeFillippo: [00:41:29] Real time.

Jordan Harbinger: [00:41:30] That's right real time. Keep sending in those questions to friday@jordanharbinger.com. Remember, keep them concise if you can't, it really does increase the chances that your question will get answered on the air. Share the show with those you love and even those you don't. Got a lot more in the pipeline, very excited for some of our upcoming guests as well. And in the meantime, do your best to apply what you hear on the show so you can live what you listen and we'll see you next time.

[00:41:53] If you like this show, you need to check out Penn's Sunday School with magician and entertainer, Penn Jillette. Each week, Penn talks to celebrities, magicians, and other entertainers about whatever he wants. Past guests include Phil Rosenthal, Dr. Joel Fuhrman, and writer and director, Kevin Smith. So check out Penn Sunday School weekly on PodcastOne or wherever you get your favorite pods.